Lawn Care Products Are Endangering Our Health

DSC_0006We have to look at all systems as social entities, historical products as well as ecological matrix systems.  Reality is very complex.  Humans are, by nature, both complex and simple at the same time. This is due to our brains being of several different layers which evolved in different time frames and under different social conditions.  The NYT ran a story today about how lawn care and anti-weed chemicals are poisoning our environment.  This is one of many causes of cancers which now plague us since we have eliminated most other forms of plague thanks to modern medicine and vaccinations.  Our solutions to other ‘problems’ are now killing us instead of enriching our lives.hurricane Bob

Hurricane Bill’s outermost arms are passing over where I live in Berlin, NY.

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This is a multi-level debate being conducted across the entire planet: in our quest to kill unwanted life forms, are we endangering ourselves?  Previous to the beginning of the 21st century, poisoning the environment was OK because the longevity of the population at large was improving rapidly.  That is, more people were living much longer lives.  In the 19th century, few people reached their sixties.  Today, this is common in first world countries.  In my own youth, people rarely reached 85 years of age.  Now, it is much more common.  In Japan, very common.

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But the stresses on the environment due to chemical and systematic triumphs of modern technology are beginning to accumulate.  Chemicals we create and spread don’t vanish magically.  They sift through the environment in various ways.  And collect at important points, one being our hydraulic systems.  That is, we are poisoning our own water we use to stay alive.  And this might kill us or deform our babies.

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Debating Just How Much Atrazine Is Safe in Your Water Glass – Series – NYTimes.com

For decades, farmers, lawn care workers and professional green thumbs have relied on the popular weed killer atrazine to protect their crops, golf courses and manicured lawns. But atrazine often washes into water supplies and has become among the most common contaminants in American reservoirs and other sources of drinking water. .

Now, new research suggests that atrazine may be dangerous at lower concentrations than previously thought. Recent studies suggest that, even at concentrations meeting current federal standards, the chemical may be associated with birth defects, low birth weights and menstrual problems.

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If we click on the NYT maps, we can see that Kansas is the most polluted with this substance.  Kansas also happens to be a very conservative state that hates the concept of Federal controls, for example.  Kansas is the Heartland in many ways which is why it has become addicted to using various chemical and medicinal shortcuts.  Kansas embodies the deep contradictions of the US public.  Basically, Kansas wants to have its cake and eat it too.  That is, use poisons on other life forms but not believe this is affecting human life forms.

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I will also note that the NYT maps show Phoenix, Arizona, as one of the worst offenders when it comes to this sort of weed poison!  I lived there when I was a child.  We lived right smack dab in the middle of the agricultural systems there.  That is, early suburbia was being built right on top of the best agricultural  lands.  The irrigation system was part of our own back yard.  That is, when they flooded the orchards around us, our yard flooded.  I loved this as a child and would swim in it.  God knows how many toxins I was exposed to, while doing this!

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Modern civilization exposes us to many, many toxins.  This is because humans want nature to fit our own ideals.  For example, the main reason Phoenix has this anti-weed chemical in profusion is due to golf courses.  In the middle of a very dry desert, we have golf courses because golfers want to play golf all the time.  Golf courses were invented in one of the wettest climates on earth.  The natural rolling grasses grazed by herds of sheep was the genesis of golf courses.  Since the desires of millions of golfers is in complete contravention with reality, we have fake rolling greens in deserts where it is not only unsustainable, but illogical.

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Humans are illogical.  We have wishes and fears.  What we fear and what we wish can be one and the same.  For example, we want to live forever.  And we want to play golf while living forever.  But to play golf, we have to poison the environment which means, we poison ourselves.  I used to have a herd of sheep.  They sheered the grass on my mountain so that it was nearly weedless.  That is, all weeds were eaten to the roots and nearly only grass grew!  But golf courses are not grazed by sheep.  They are cut by lawn mowers.

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DSC_0009Lawn mowers don’t select and eat all the weeds to the roots.  So when we mow, weeds proliferate.  When I lived in New Jersey, one of the most noxious things was when the ‘lawn care’ people did their summer toxic spraying.  We had to keep the dogs and cats away from this.  I tore out my own front lawn and replaced it with trees, rocks and flower beds.  But my neighbors used poisons to kill weeds.  And again, I had to shut the windows when this was going on.

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But this stuff flows into the water table during rain storms and winter snowmelts.  All poisons used to kill insects and weeds end up inside our own bodies via the air and water systems we share with all living things.  Understanding how nature works is important.  Golf courses should be forced, BY LAW, to use only sheep for mowing, for example.  The sheep also fertilize these lawns, incidentally.  No need for fertilizers which are also wrecking our water systems.  People who imagine that a system of chaos will protect us from poisons are deluded.

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We have to have sane rules and regulations to prevent shortcuts like we see with golf courses.   That is, instead of running these systems the way they first evolved, people who want to profit from running a golf course are using poisons and machines to replicate what sheep do, naturally and with no disruption to the environment.  We humans are very prone to wanting shortcuts.  The organic movement arose in contravention to the chemical short cut system because people are reasonably afraid of pollution.

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We are bathed in pollutions!  I use a plural here.  In the Middle Ages, people lived with pollutions!  That is, sanitary problems coupled with the use of various manufacturing systems such as ironwork, leather dying and curing, etc. were all dumped straight into rivers and fields.  Third world nations do this all the time, today.

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Only in recent years, starting in my grandfather’s time, was there any attempt at controlling this pollution.  Proper sewage systems are a recent invention.  The capturing and cleaning of waste water was begun during my own lifetime.  But this is all futile if we continue to increase using unnecessary chemicals so we can have the illusion of various ecosystems like golf courses without sheep grazing them.  The use of weed killer in suburban gardening is particularly stupid.  It is used to kill ‘weeds’ like dandelions.

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Dandelions can be eaten and turned into other useable things as well as having pretty flowers.  Yet, we poison ourselves in order to kill these pretty plants if they dare to grow in the middle of lawns we want to look as if sheep are grazing.  Dandelions don’t proliferate where there are sheep for the simple reason, sheep think dandelions are delicious!  They hunt them down and eat them up!

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The reason golf courses and public parks use no sheep is simple: you need either a shepherd with dogs or considerable fences to keep the sheep in.  A graveyard recently made the news because they tried using sheep to keep the graveyard looking sweet.  Our modern graveyards are based on the British ones that were mowed by herds of sheep because wool was England’s most important export product during the Middle Ages.  Mowing around gravestones is difficult.  Sheep naturally mow around them.  But people objected to lambs walking on graves, for some bizarre cultural reason.

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So the experiment was terminated. People were more comfortable with pollution-belching, noisy, noxious machines rolling over graves with a scythe swishing loudly.  Bizarre, isn’t this?  Human minds are queer things.  I would think the imagery of soft, wooly sheep quietly grazing or maybe, baa-ing, would generate images of peace and love.  But no, the machine that can chop off the mower’s feet if they are careless: this was preferred only because this is considered ‘normal’.

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DSC_0007Our idea of ‘normality’ is based on a petro-chemical culture that totally surrounds us and has become so common, we can’t imagine other systems.  Just as gas lawnmowers replaced the hand push mowers which replaced the sheep, chemicals have replaced natural methods of removing ‘weeds’.  And weeds are things we don’t want to see growing.  There is no bad ‘weed’ as far as Mother Nature is concerned!

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Or even sheep are concerned!  Goats eat everything in their path so they think there is no such thing as weeds.  Everything is ‘food’.  We have to have some sort of ideal society inside of our own heads so we can strive for this.  Living in harmony with Nature and with other humans is the ideal.  We might not achieve this but we have to have this as an ideal.

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The appearance of the ideal, when this is achieved via dumping toxins and poisons into the air and water and soil is a great evil.  This gives the illusion of lush nature but it actually killing nature and thus, ourselves.  We have to decide: can we coexist with ‘weeds’ or are we willing to kill ourselves in order to eliminate other life forms?

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This is like the MAD nuclear bomb business: instead of eliminating nuclear bombs, we want to have them in reserve and then hope no one would be crazy enough to use them in warfare.  This is stupid because humans are crazy.  When given a choice, we often take the short cut.  This is why nukes were invented: the US wanted to end WWII quickly.  We were tired of it.  Nuking civilians was a great tool.  Only it lingers on as a greater and greater danger to us, ourselves.  We ended WWII very abruptly.  But we created the possibility of WWIII ending equally abruptly, the same way.  Only, there would not be two nukes dropped on cities but thousands of them, all over all the cities.

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Sometimes, retreating from some sort of modern system is wiser than pressing forwards.  In the case of anti-weed systems, returning to the old crop rotation/sheep grazing systems is wiser than pushing for more exotic chemical and machine solutions to ancient natural systems.

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29 Comments

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29 Responses to Lawn Care Products Are Endangering Our Health

  1. w.c.

    The reason golf courses

    the way to ruin a perfectly good walk ..

  2. emsnews

    The true story here is, weed killers are more dangerous than vaccinations. Vaccinations have rare side effects. Weed killing poisons are very insidious and far more dangerous. I hope Nightmare and the others here go hop off to their favored conspiracy theory sites and begin howling about golf courses being deadly. Heh. Might even bean a few golfers in protest.

    I can see it now: the conspiracy community rises up in arms and assail golf carts, turning them over and storming the country club drinking rooms and sucking down all the scotch. :) At least, they can have some fun. :)

  3. herbfarmerbill

    I like the idea of tilling in that lawn and to grow food and flowers. I call it “lawngone”.

  4. emsnews

    And growing veggies at home is lots of fun, good to eat and cheap. :)

  5. ralf

    Sorry, Elaine, but I haven’t hopped off to another site as yours is much too interesting and fun to read. And I’m enormously pleased that you’ve considered/written about the harmful effects of weed killers and such on the environment and the human body. I, too, am totally opposed to golf courses in areas of drought. I lived in Palm Springs and saw first hand the overuse of fertilizers, pesticides, and herbicides. Not to speak about the unwise use of a scarce and precious commodity: fresh water. The many pools and golf courses have also raised the humidity of an area blessed with dry heat.

    My concerns about health relate to the total body. We have to look at health and the human body holistically. And I don’t believe the AMA or ADA does that. I also don’t believe the FDA does a good job in protecting us from actions that are not beneficial to good health. I’ve never thought there were governmental agencies intent upon wiping out huge swaths of populations but they are often acting out of ignorance of holistic health. So, I’m not talking about activities that would result in death but that which might result in impaired functioning. Often, actions taken in your twenties dont’ manifest a dis-ease until later years.

    I’m very much against mercury amalgams and flouridation in water supplies or tooth paste. In 2006 the FDA was sued by the Consumers for Dental Choice. In the court settlement the FDA was required to withdraw claims of mercury safety from its website and issue an advisory indicating that dental amalgams containing mercury may have neurotoxic effects on the nervous systems of developing children and fetuses. Just last month the FDA broke this settlement agreement and reclassified amalgams as Class II devices and stated that there were no known long term ill effects for using mercury amalgams on children or pregnant women. The FDA in this instance is not acting on behalf of our best interests. I suspect profit motives are at play here. A full 50 % of dentists are still using mercury for fillings. Who’s at risk? Since the middle class has largely moved on to resins, plastics and composites, it’s the poor, the minorities, and institutional recipients still getting the mercury fillings. And mercury vapor is released when people chew and brush their teeth. Tooth grinding is particularly troublesome. So, it’s not as if once you have a filling it’s in and forgotten. And problems in and around teeth can cause a multitude of health issues only now being realized. Canadian dentists have been told not to put mercury amalgams in children or pregnant women. The same is true in Britain. And in Norway and Sweden they have been banned altogether. According to Consumers for Dental Choices dentists purchase nearly 40 tons of mercury each year…over 35 million micrograms put into the bodies of humans and ultimately the environment. Especially, with the rise in the number of cremations.

    I believe it’s essential for everyone to do what is necessary to protect their health. It’s a personal responsibility. You cannot rely on the government to act always in accordance to your best interests as there are other factors/agendas at play. I’ve done my fair share of studying and reading to come to my conclusions re: mercury amalgams, flouridation, and the ,ahem, “v” word. (grins) And I don’t believe I’ve gone to any conspiracy sites to do this. I’m not forcing my beliefs on anyone else but I do have a responsibility to speak up when I read or see something that I don’t agree with after many years of educating myself.

    I don’t consider myself as part of a lunatic fringe although I do realize that many people untutored in healthy ways and the human body would argue otherwise. So be it. I do wish for all humanity the right to good health. BTW, dandelions are the greatest…eaten, they can alleviate many gastro problems. Everyone should have a lawn full. (big grin)

  6. emsnews

    Holistic health is good for everything EXCEPT when it comes to diseases that are fixed ONLY via vaccinations!

    No vaccinations=no holistic health, maybe even death. The holistic health movement got traction only after the worst of the deadly viral and bacterial diseases were fixed by the act of inoculations.

    The fact that ‘holistic healers’ minimize this and deny this infuriates me. They, like all humans, like to think they are good and their philosophy is the end all and be all of all creation and it certainly is not.

    Holistic health is good for keeping ‘normal’ but useless when it comes to exterior attacks like rabies or polio, etc. The side effects of vaccinations even including some mercury is far, far better than letting these diseases run rampant. Period.

    People drink all sorts of minerals and chemicals with water since the dawn of time. The mix has changed over the years with industrialization which is why we have to study pollution and check it when it happens.

    Just like mercury: the tiny amounts in tooth fillings or inoculations is nothing compared to the amounts we consume via water and fish as well as other sources. So if we must fear something, at least tooth fillings and vaccinations help us, mercury in fish is avoidable, you won’t die because you didn’t eat fish while you can die from tooth infections as well as diseases the inoculations protect us from.

  7. w.c.

    this idea put forth
    \]
    that truth, is seen only one way, and that from a platform of ones experience , factoring emotional, and biological, and the human lense of self interest. We then can follow like the wildabeest the exact behavior of its species,

    This can only lead to a the conclusion of a life the same , all seeing, being, framing of issues and emotional experience.

    Nature does not work that way ,, a leaf , a flower, a tree, a rock, express in different ways.

    As does the human. we can not say we have no need of thee. All of nature crys out for the parts of it’s self, differences of expression, view points and related social and family of origins color the preception.

    We do not know the experience of others, or their truth. We think we can know ours.

    a mother believed the son daughter was a saint. the neighbor saw a rouge.
    a jury can judge innocence, or guilt and in some cases same evidence different conclusions.

    ask a passer by to provide clues to what he sees and 20 different answers can then cloud the conclusion.

    Text written thousand of years ago. Are they objective? do they spell out truth.

    things morph from year to year. as even the best scientific evidence is subject to change ,

    History take on new meaning with more complete information.. some times years go by until the requisite informatiom makes it’s self known.
    \
    Be slow to judge, careful of other’s motives..

    Change oneself , then change the other fellow. some times after the change in ourself the neighbor looks quite favorable..

    Have they changed why no.. We see from a less clouded vision, the thorn we see in others, has been eclipsed as we wipe the beam from our own nature.

  8. Tom Parsons

    Sheep and golf courses – heh.

    I walk through sheep-filled pastures most days, to watch sunrise over the Hauraki Gulf from a nearby hilltop. In the other direction lies a very high-priced golf course (once even patronized by Prince Charles!).

    I’m reasonably careful where I put my feet, but avoiding *all* that fresh fertilizer would be more like an extended game of hopscotch than a walk. Can you imagine all those golfers picking the stuff out of their cleats? And can you guess how often the little dimpled ball would end up rolling to a stop right up against one of the rather large turds that are produced first thing in the morning?

    Golfers would rather be poisoned.

    BTW, do sheep eat young gorse? That would make it worthwhile to fence off the young trees I’m planting and get some sheep, since I’d also like to minimize poisons.

    ΩΩΩΩΩΩΩΩΩΩΩΩΩΩΩΩ

    ELAINE: HAHAHA. Um, have you ever been around sheep? I had over 55 sheep. Their ‘turds’ are TINY. Like, little round balls you can barely find in the grass. You are talking about cows. Cows and horses make big dumps. Sheep and deer have small dumps. Many golf courses are visited by deer at night. Ask any groundskeepers. Sheep droppings are nearly as small as rabbit pellets.

  9. emsnews

    As I keep saying, people can’t use mirrors to see themselves. This is human nature. When we try to persuade others to view things differently, people fight. This is because the hardest thing on earth one can do is to change one’s mind.

    People do hop from one fashion to another, very easily. But while holding onto a fashion, it is like stone, so long as everyone else is being fashionable the same way.

    This is, we are creatures who have an addiction to copying others. We are often entirely unaware of this but note that people selling stuff will spend immense sums of money ‘advertising’ their wares in the hopes that we find it ‘fashionable’.

    In the world of ideas, this works too. Note that the gang that passed by here recently were working in tandem to convince everyone their various ticks and phobias are correct and my analysis (based mostly on science or mainstream news) is stupid.

    There is tremendous confusion over ‘what is science’ which shows up glaringly when people peddle weird ideas.

    For example, when I challenged the notion that vaccinations kill more people than they save (a totally RIDICULOUS idea!) there was zero scientific proof given to back their contention, just more talking around the facts.

    Waves of irrational fear sweep even the scientific community. Keeping our heads on straight is very difficult. This is because we are always in the ‘here and now’ and not in the past or future.

    To see the future, we have to first see the past. There are scientific tools to do this and I use these a lot (statistics, archeology, written records, etc.).

    People are going to continue to be confused because we are exposed to many sorts of dangers, all over the place. Most dangers are invisible to us (pollution ozone, for example or excessive CO2). Some of it is obvious and we just don’t care (driving cars, flying jets, playing golf when one hears thunder).

    Humans ignore deadly dangers because we want to do something so we just don’t care all that much. The person who might be scared to death of inoculations will speed along a highway while text messaging, for example.

    Studies have shown over and over again, people’s fears seldom match real dangers. Often, these fears are set by fashion. The fashion designers pick and choose which fears to peddle and then push, push, push.

    Will you buy these fears? Or be a careful shopper?

  10. w.c.

    agreed try to change ems mind lol

    set in stone .. especially over 9-11,

    this is valuable forensic work Not fiction.

    just one glaring incident in the coverup of enormous historical value,

    does it make me fear , no.. is it an interesting historical fact,, EVEN a CIA person probably would endorse,, like coverup shadows , boo.

    space aliens , big foot, and assorted folk lore.. has been around for years,, the gremlins grabbing ones leg on the bridge to control, the forest of demons to control .

    these examples and the 9-11 incident are hardly the same ,, even tough some would like to lump them together lol

    bull shit is bullshit even if it comers from a deer , a cow , or a mouth lol

  11. w.c.

    though erratta,, tough

  12. emsnews

    I don’t go ape over the bombs in the building garbage because I know a great deal about demolitions.

    You choose to disregard this but that is OK. No one listens to me.

  13. w.c.

    bombs in the building

    thermite ,, and 100′s of others are stupid ,,

    elaine please ,, you are not the only person to build a house let alone a 100 story bldg.

    how dis bldg three fall again, at almost free fall into its own footprints , and the other two by fire from jet fuel in to their own footprints once again for the first time any steel structured bldg to do this. name any other ,,

    hokus pokus fall.. lol

    plus all the other problems .. no wc will not buy this from you are any one who tells this =tale of bull.

    colored balls of string and sacks of garbage on this one ems

    yes and the atomic blast is a future probelm that we do not overlook

    my iq probubly approaches yours tucson lol

  14. w.c.

    look large turds small turds \\

    was a cow here , a deer

    no it was a large bird

    thermite here 12 tons

    what was it,

    a large flying passport remains

    birds leve shit

    random passports leave thermite

    if the bull fits .. its superwomen lol

  15. w.c.

    willie on armstrong

    ems wrongly believes both sinclair and armstrong deserve jail lol or were in jail.. or or ,, or ..

    MARTIN ARMSTRONG IS A FINANCIAL MARKET ANALYST, JAILED FOR KNOWING TOO MUCH ABOUT INNER WORKING WALL STREET CORRUPTION. HE IS PRESCIENT, AND GIVES FURTHER WARNINGS. $$$ The latest analysis by Martin Armstrong has found its way from his prison bars. He cannot be totally silenced. He warns in an August 7th release entitled “Cycles & Pattern Projections” of a consolidation stage soon to end that lifts the gold price to triple its current level, first from a global monetary crisis, then a follow through due to the arrival of price inflation.

  16. w.c.

    willie on lawn care

    The last False Flag Attack was World Trade Center and Pentagon on 911 for all those whose brain stems are not disconnected, or brain cavities unused.

    Be sure to know that Sinking the Maine off the Cuban coast is well known to be another False Flag Attack to trigger the Spanish American War

    ΩΩΩΩΩΩΩΩΩΩΩΩΩΩ

    ELAINE; The sinking of the Maine is very similar to the 9/11 ‘Truthers’: Both were the outcome of various ‘natural’ events —one was the explosion of a boiler and the other was a failure of the basic structure when badly damaged—which people imagined were conspiracies to attack us run by governments.

    9/11 was a conspiracy hatched by revolutionary Muslims using very cheap tools (box cutters) to hijack some jets, it didn’t have elaborate bombs in the buildings that had to be set, organized, etc. That is, like all real conspiracies, the 9/11 guys were very few in number and used easily available tools while the elaborate ‘bombs in the buildings’ conspiracy theories involve using many, many people doing lots and lots of secret labors in one of the most public buildings on earth, namely, the WTC complex had more employees working there than any building complex on the entire planet.

    Not to mention, it was a tourist attraction and also was easily observed from even far away! The 9/11 conspiracy bomb belief system can’t accept that idea that our leadership simply allowed an attack to happen (it is very easy to conspire to do nothing). But the same people who can’t imagine that, can imagine that these same people (who do the easy thing, that is, stand down while under attack) would instead, do a very complex and dangerous thing that is very hard to hide (bombing the building after Muslim terrorists already did all the heavy lifting of doing an attack).

    The fact that the public fell for a false story in 1895 doesn’t mean the stupid 9/11 bombs fairy tale is correct. It simply shows that people can be fooled into imagining things are more complex than they actually are.

  17. w.c.

    willie again

    But then, were there not thousands of Germans who denied the existence of concentration camps during World War II? These types of people would refuse to believe the sun came up in the east if the government spinmeisters told them it did not.”

    This camp existence denial is yet another parallel to the events in Nazi Germany 70 years ago. Other parallels can be listed. Reichstag burning and Krystalnacht events were the World Trade Center demolition and Pentagon missile attack rolled into one. The Security Act that heralded the fascist movement was the Patriot Act, which abridged rights and unleashed the hunt. The War against the invisible Zionist Army was the War on Terrorism against Islamic Armies. Denial of death camps is the next item in synch. One must ask where many of the US leaders came from. See the Examiner article (CLICK HERE).

    CHINA SHUNS USDOLLAR & SEEKS GOLD

    ΩΩΩΩΩΩΩΩΩΩΩΩΩΩ

    ELAINE: The Reichstag fire wasn’t the only public buildings set on fire during the Great Depression in Germany and Austria. Like 9/11, a terrorist did this act and the Nazis, like the GOP, then used this as an excuse to suspend the Constitution and eliminate civil rights. Over the last 70 years, there has been this denial of the facts that gets worse every year. That is, people have to claim that the Nazis set the fire. The chances of that are slim. People forget, the Communists, ANARCHISTS and Fascists were fighting each other all over Europe (Spanish Civil War, for example, was a three-way fight, ditto in China).

    Anarchists traditionally go for things like the Reichstag Fire and shooting of officials. Fascists trend towards mass rallies and bullying people in the streets. For example, we saw this in Arizona recently with a gang of fascists marching around, UNDER POLICE PROTECTION, menacing the President.

  18. illuminator

    Idiots expose themselves by adhering to demonstrated errors, and shills expose themselves by adhering to errors of demonstrated frauds. For idiots such as w.c. and frauds such as Armstrong opportune is this recent CFTC announcement:

    “For Release: August 21, 2009

    New York Federal Court Orders Martin Armstrong, Princeton Global Management and Princeton Economics International to Pay More Than $27 Million in Remaining Restitution in CFTC Anti-Fraud Action

    Latest restitution award concludes multi agency enforcement actions in which more than $665 million in sanctions have been ordered.”

    How much idiots unconsciously adhere to frauds, so much they are predictable. W.c. would presume both the CFTC and Federal Court to have “unjustly” prosecuted the fraudster Armstrong for cause of “covering up” Armstrong’s “exposee” of some Federal “conspiracy”; meanwhile idiot shills such as w.c. neglect the $600MM deficiency in Armstrong’s partnerships: even had the Feds “unjustly” arrested Armstrong, someone lost or stole $600MM from Armstrong’s partnership. Armstrong knows nothing about markets or trading, but he does know something about money laundering and theft; Feds have compelled Safra’s Republic Bank to compensate Armstrong’s Japanese limited partners, which compulsion indicates Republic’s complicity in some money-laundering scheme. Some traders do know the gold market and on balance trade gold profitably, but w.c. cites constantly only known frauds and convicted felons, which constancy as noted above indicates an idiot and a shill.

  19. emsnews

    Several years ago, I learned a harsh lesson about checking my sources. This is why I don’t link to Mr. Armstrong’s articles. He is just like Madoff. I am surprised that Madoff hasn’t pulled a similar con game.

    Give the guy time! I bet he will begin to manipulate the paranoid community in order to save his own skin!

  20. w.c.

    ems

    This is why I don’t link to Mr. Armstrong’s articles. He is just like Madoff. I am surprised that Madoff hasn’t pulled a similar con game

    how do you know he is like madoff … madoff has not a clue about cycles…

    apples and oranges ,,

    why did martha go to prizon. (I have no truck with her) for a minor offense of which she was convicted of.. now we have front trading where is jail tine .. huge trading in airline stock 9-11,

    some times you have a habit of straw men .. because maddoff , spacemen, big foot , kooky stuff,, then throw in 9-11, grassy knoll, now armstrong , sinclair ,, to show things that are with out question a problems .. and then throw in the mix things that you really know little about or is uncorfortable because of a prior happening .and say see no need to go their.. step along lol

    just because

    A happened before .. it does not always follow that B is the same .. or an A that is happening is the same problem .

  21. w.c.

    dim bulb and twitter..

    discoverer of the Pi Cycle Economic Confidence Model, persecuted by the US Government, denied his constitutional rights. Mr. Armstrong says, the court told him they knew he did not steal money and he says the government know’s that Republic Bank employees did illegal trading in his Princeton Economic accounts but apparently the government cannot admit to being wrong so Armstrong remains in prison going on 10 years now!

    What gives these bureaucrats the right to ruin a man’s life! The truth about Martin can be found here:

    http://www.scribd.com/kzuur58

    so leonard pelteir got his just deserets with the courts ,,

    i believe we have found the crybaby,,in the crowd,,

    yet we know nothing about you, do you molest little dogs .

  22. emsnews

    WC, one of the saddest things I see is how easily people who claim to be conspiracy experts are fooled by every Tom, Dick and Harry.

  23. w.c.

    above

    Martin Armstrong’s Princeton Economics

    ems

    here you go again .. how you are saddened by people believing every tom dick and harry ,,

    what makes you think w.c. believes every tom dick and harry ,,

    sinclair, armstrong, stephen jones willie are not just tom dick and harry , i find them very credible based on my experience .. which i have posted from time to time and as you have .. not as some do.. spit and regurgitate.. while hidding under a cover of worn out platudes of finger pointing ,

    perhaps every elaine , nancy and jane.
    \
    these are teckniques of propaganda,,

    illuminator does not molest dogs ,, but saying it may twist a mind ..

  24. illuminator

    Jackass:

    Anyone who runs a hedge fund is a professional investor and thus accepts no protection from FINRA or NFA, so Armstrong had a fiduciary duty to his limited partners to always know any trading or funds transfers from his partnership accounts; so had Republic traded without Armstrong’s authorization, Armstrong had a duty to know it and cease it; instead Armstrong detects himself as not only an idiot and a thief but also a stooge. In addition, “cycle” trading or “seasonal” trading is widely known in the trading world to be a fraud and instrument for con men like Armstrong; NFA has banned permanently frauds like Jake Bernstein for using “cycles” to defraud retail investors; NFA never banned Armstrong, as he conned institutional and professional investors through his hedge fund. Armstrong knows nothing of cycles, and only idiots use cycles to trade, and Armstrong demonstrably either stole $600MM or lost it trading markets. As I observed before, there are good traders and good analysts, but you only cite known frauds.

  25. w.c.

    ems

    the jury is still out on armstrong .. but contraire to illuminator who also throws innunedo in the air about cycles ,,

    their are both side to this issue .. and until the real story is told .. which may be years hence.

    as for goldman trading patterns illuminot er\\ is quite

    and as far as trading probably has less than two moldy nickles to rub ..as i say nothing is known of the judge and jury in this case ,, other than shouting i am the wet rug in crowded bldgs to put out the fire

    some bring nothing to the table of discussion waiting in the wings of defacto straw men, to point fingers,

    having never read his work on history .. having no knowlege of fibonicci circles, and the nature of all cycles.

  26. emsnews

    There are ‘great cycles’: humans do the same mistakes over and over again, thus, the cycles. We can detect future dangers by observing how a cycle is repeating itself. We do this by applying data and useful systems analysis coupled with psychoanalytical understanding.

    All con artists use real information and then mix it up with lies. This includes the CIA, for example. We are prone to being conned and there is a trick to spot cons: when they have to give an honest timeline for events that directly impact their own affairs, they begin lying like crazy and can’t tell a straight story.

    Graphs and charts are great for illustrating things but cannot be used to predict the exact timing of events. People like using these as a form of Tarot card reading because we like to see the future even if we can’t or don’t want to know the truth about the future.

    The CIA wanted people who could ‘see the future’ only they wanted people to see the official future the rulers of the US wanted to see, not the real real future.

    Same with economic futurists: they want to have a future that conforms to their own wishes. Armstrong did this, when he was trying to get rich, fast. Ditto, Madoff. Like with governments, they will lie, cheat and steal if this makes their future desires come real.

    A cold-blooded look at systems means obvious hazards are obvious. This is why I selected ‘free trade’ as the dragon I must slay. Connected to ‘free trade’ is WWIII, by the way, that is, the Apocalypse.

  27. illuminator

    Jackass:

    The jury isn’t out on Armstrong: the jury convicted the conman and money launderer of fraud and running a Ponzi scheme. Don’t describe my dispute on cycles as “innuendo[sic](baseless?)”, as both experts and authorities have regulated baseless assertions such as Armstrong’s “cycle” trading as frauds; here is NFA’s–the same authority that sanctioned Sinclair for fraud–1998 Interpretive Notice:

    9034 – NFA COMPLIANCE RULE 2-29: DECEPTIVE ADVERTISING
    (Board of Directors, September 2, 1998)
    INTERPRETIVE NOTICE

    NFA Compliance Rule 2-29 prohibits the use of promotional material which is misleading or deceptive. The purpose of the rule is to protect the public from fraudulent advertising and sales solicitations and provide guidance to Members on the standards by which their promotional material will be evaluated.

    In June 1996, NFA issued a Notice to Members (I-96-11) entitled “Deceptive Advertising.” The notice described certain misleading advertising practices that some Members were employing, mainly in radio and TV ads. These included claims suggesting that so-called seasonal trades produce dramatic profits year-in and year-out; claims regarding historic price moves in particular commodities that suggested that the same record setting move was likely to occur again; claims of dramatic profits made by customers based on isolated trades in specific customer accounts (so-called “cherry picked” trades); and claims concerning projected profits, (e.g., “turn $10,000 into $40,000″).

    The June 1996 Notice made clear that NFA would regard these types of claims to be misleading and a clear violation of NFA sales practice rules unless the Member can demonstrate that based on the actual performance of its customers those claims are not misleading. Since the issuance of the June 1996 Notice, NFA has brought a number of disciplinary cases against Members who have employed misleading advertising techniques of the type described in the Notice. Recently, however, NFA has encountered variations of these types of advertising problems. Due to these recent developments, NFA considers it advisable to issue this supplemental Notice.

  28. Armstrong had a big prediction ,at least according to guru Sinclair that the markets would downturn in june [?] . One of his ‘cycles ‘, he is a generalist.

    but, back to nature. Just got back from a plunge into the remote BC wilderness. Where, while staring at some rocks I had the sudden insight that in a place like that with plunging glaciers, water, light, air, that even the rocks in the morraine were alive in a way that things in man trampled world were not. In the pass there was an old [1990's] miners cabin that had fallen over ,slowly being absorbed ,chewed by animals crushed by snow, into the organism that is this earth.

  29. emsnews

    The markets didn’t collapse in June, 2007. This happened after July 17, 2007 when Japan and China began a currency dispute. This, in turn, killed the ‘Japanese carry trade’ which lead to ‘liquidity (easy lending) drying up’. Then, the world markets collapsed.

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