Iran Will Cut Off All Oil To Europe Tomorrow

There is this ancient Chinese curse: may your wishes be granted.  The US and Israel demanded that Europe threaten Iran with a full oil and bank seizure and closure unless Iran, like Iraq and Libya, disarms and lays down for a NATO invasion and occupation.

 

Not being stupid, Iran said, ‘You don’t want our oil, eh?  Good.  No more oil!’  So here it is in German news:  Revenge for EU Sanctions: Iran Set to Turn Off Oil Supply to Europe – SPIEGEL ONLINE.  The Germans have been ordered to bail out the euro and save all of southern Europe.  Today, Fitch Downgrades Spain, Belgium, Cyprus, Italy and Slovenia all of whom import Iranian oil or are suffering from too-high world oil prices caused by US led NATO invasions since Bush illegally invaded Iraq on spurious, false charges.

 

Japan imports Iranian oil, too.  And is being hammered to death after 3/11/11.  One might suggest Mother Nature loves magic numbers, by the way.  Noda struggles to conquer Japan’s debt mountain with the IMF says Japan should raise consumption tax to 15% but even raising it to 10% has the hard-pressed Japanese screaming in pain.

 

Israelis See Iran’s Threats of Retaliation as Bluff was the Zionist headlines in the US as this dual citizen reporter, Bonner (only Jews get to report on their affairs, of course, and everyone else’s affairs!) talks with the top rulers of America, off the record, of course, and they are all convinced of two things: Iran wouldn’t do a thing to stop the US and Israel and a war would be very limited there.

 

Of course, we get to pay for it all.  Iraq is literally blowing itself apart right next door and far from being a safe base, is very dangerous to the US.

 

“A war (with Iran) is no picnic,” Defense Minister Ehud Barak told Israel Radio in November. But if Israel feels itself forced into action, the retaliation would be bearable, he said. “There will not be 100,000 dead or 10,000 dead or 1,000 dead. The state of Israel will not be destroyed.”

 

No, a thousand Jews won’t die.  But 10,000 or 100,000 American citizens will die.  Nor will Israel suffer even slightly, financially.  The US public will be hammered and more social services will slip off the map and disappear along with many elderly and children dying one way or another.

 

The ruler of America, Netanyahu, says the Iranians would greet us with flowers.  They would rise up and overthrow their more or less democratically elected government if the US bombs them.  This is beyond insane, it is how Hitler used to think and this man is Hitler.  A Nazi.

 

Here is more delusional thinking from Jewish Zionists in Israel:

 

A paper soon to be published by the Institute for National Security Studies at Tel Aviv University, written by Amos Yadlin, former chief of military intelligence, and Yoel Guzansky, who headed the Iran desk at Israel’s National Security Council until 2009, argues that the Iranian threat to close the Strait of Hormuz is largely a bluff.

 

The paper contends that, despite the risks of Iranian provocation, Iran would not be able to close the waterway for any length of time and that it would not be in Iran’s own interest to do so.

 

UPDATE:  At Davos, the hobnob spot for the super rich and the super powerful and a handful of EU toadies, Israel calls for tougher Iran sanctions 

In a session at the World Economic Forum in Davos, Barak said: “You can’t conceive of a stable world order when Iran has nuclear weapons.”

He added: “Iran is prepared to defy and deceive the whole world to turn themselves into a nuclear power. This will be the end of any conceivable anti-proliferation programme. Major powers in the region will feel compelled to turn nuclear.”

Saudi Arabia, Turkey and Egypt would respond to Iran arming itself with nuclear weapons with programmes of their own, Barak said.

Yukiya Amano, the director-general of the International Atomic Energy Agency, said he was sending a team to Iran on Saturday, adding he was convinced that Tehran was seeking to establish a nuclear weapons capability.

So, the IAEA new leader is ‘convinced’ that Iran is getting nukes?  Based on what, exactly?  Oh, the ‘toady to the US/Israel heavily nuclear armed thugs’ business.  Since Israel and the US and sling nukes all over the planet with impunity and no one controlling them, why can’t all nations do this???  Eh?  The IAEA was supposed to disarm the top nuclear powers, originally.  And the only one to use nukes on civilians is the US, not Iraq or Iran or Libya.

 

There is a 100% chance Iran will close the narrow opening of the bag that is the Persian Gulf.  It is easy to do.  It is legal for them to do this if NATO basically declares war on Iran.  Iran has a huge case in its favor, showing clearly a pattern of dishonesty in US demands they disarm or not gain arms.  The US has steadfastly refused to disarm itself and menaces the entire planet with a huge nuclear arsenal, the biggest on earth and the greatest military arm on earth.

 

Russia and China agree with disarming the US.  The other thing is, the King of Saudi Arabia that is scared of his own Shi’ite population and Iran, agrees!  He would like to either have nukes, too, or have ALL the Middle East disarm especially Israel.

 

Everyone on earth who has half a brain knows that Israel has a huge nuclear arsenal.  They are the only nuclear armed nation on earth never investigated or examined by anyone.  It is kept secret.  This is the ONLY COUNTRY ON EARTH who did this.  North Korea bases their right to have nukes exactly for this reason: Israel gets away with this.

 

All of us will pay for this stupid game.  We will see $200+ dollars a barrel gas in the near future and I wish I was walking for I would  be hoarding gasoline pronto!!!!  The EU and US economies will collapse, big time.  Hyperinflation will mean homes won’t be heated, cars won’t run and the global warming people should be hysterically happy about this. We will freeze to death next winter, hooray!

 

I hear from everyone in my region, joy and happiness that thanks to the Pacific Ocean La Nina and the Atlantic Warm Cycle, we have a mild winter.  People here are scared to death of high fuel costs and hurting badly, already.  And we can thank Hillary Clinton for her tireless work, making us suffer as much as possible.  The media loves here because they are Zionists.  But we better figure out who is causing the price of fuel to shoot upwards so fast.

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40 Comments

Filed under .diplomacy, religion, war and peace

40 responses to “Iran Will Cut Off All Oil To Europe Tomorrow

  1. Old Ari

    It won’t be easy to replace the Iranian light sweet crude, European refineriesare engineered for it, not the Saudi sour crude.

  2. emsnews

    Correct. And it is now very obvious that the seizure of Libya’s oil was so they could pump like crazy, store it and then cut off Iran. This barely has begun this week and the Iranians know this.

    I do say, this is a classic game of Go where some fool piles all his stones in an obvious group only to be surrounded by a few artfully laid stones. The US thought its NATO puppet states would join with anti-Shi’a dictators to ‘surround’ Iran.

    Only the goofballs screwed up Pakistan TOTALLy and is losing rapidly in Afghanistan and has been pushed out of Iraq more or less. This week, the US let off a mass murderer who committed war crimes against Iraqi civilians!

    And Iraq just announced they will take this up at the Hague! The US has a zillion war crimes under our aegis and we are in deeper and deeper trouble and then there is Israel’s crimes! Wow.

    So: Yemen is on fire, Egypt is now Muslim Brotherhood Inc and Libya is rioting and…we, not Iran, is slowly losing ground or rather, quickly losing ground. It is too late to ‘surround’ Iran. Way too late.

  3. Christian W

    I hope the ICC can lose it’s shackles and start to prosecute US and Israeli war crimes! What an enormous step in the direction of freedom that would be.

    Here is an interesting article about how the Norwegian people overthrew the rule of the elite and established a far more egalitarian society.

    http://www.informationclearinghouse.info/article30364.htm

    The bottom line is what OWS so far has failed to realize. There is only one punch line needed:

    PUBLIC INTEREST!

    It is not in the interest of the 99 % to be ripped off by the 1 % and have their jobs and living standard destroyed.

    Public interest is the way to take back control over Washington and Wall Street.

  4. Christian W

    The Ayn Rand/rugged pioneer/libertarian/conservative small government fiction is so destructive for the US politcal discourse, from the point of view of the middle class and working class.

    You have been shattered into a million pieces, quite masterfully, by the ruling elite. Instead of joining against the tiny dot in your mulitudes by common goals of self interest, the opposition is fragmented into a seemingly million pieces without a common voice or genuine leadership. Racism, religious issues, emotionally manipulative political discourse (Limbaugh, Gingrich), institutionalised militarism etc etc etc has been used to fragment politically what is the natural balance against the ruling elite.

  5. DeVaul

    As an American, I can say you are absolutely right. There is not a shred of community left here, except for the tribal traitors, who milk us like cows.

    The concept of the “public interest” was destroyed by Ronald Reagon’s “cowboy from hell” rugged individualism and pounded into our brains by every conceivable media outlet since then. Any talk of serving others or helping others for the common good is sneered at by everyone as “unamerican”. I heard these sneers long before I lost my hearing.

    I was just thinking today about how isolated I/we are. My boss only cares about his silly job and his 401k plan. He has no other interests. My co-worker cannot see anything beyond his gadgets, and his generation is pretty much totally preoccupied with these handheld idiot boxes.

    It is not that we are physcially unprepared for the coming collapse (although a case could be made that 1/3 rd are), it is that we are completely and totally mentally unprepared. Hardly anyone now knows how to deal with another human being face to face, and that will be the first shock that hits us when we can no longer afford electricity or gasoline. When the gadgets stop, everyone will collectively look up and say: “Hey, what happened?”

    You cannot build a community on that.

  6. Christian W

    A metaphor I always liked in Ken Kesey’s “One flew over the Cuckoo’s nest” is how the Indian Chief describes his alcoholism in terms of how he “climbed into the bottle”.

    Well, a lot of us have various “bottles” we have climbed into. Sports, computers and yes the modern “gadgets” are very much “bottles” for the young generation and pretty much most people. (This is by no means an American problem exclusively).

    But when it comes to the US I see so many intelligent people sitting inside their own “castles” in a way and commenting, observing, objecting, discussing etc. So many bright people have so many good ideas and brilliant breakdowns on what is going on.

    Yet where is the political action and momentum? There is none, because what there is is done either on the terms of the Democratic/GOP parties (which imo is pointless if you look at genuine change) or splintered into nothingness. People are within boxes (“bottles”) of sorts.

    There should only be one policy question asked, and that will lead a long way. Is this in the Public Interest?

    The guy in the Tiny Dot video was thinking in terms of taking things back from the government. But he should think in terms of the mulitude joining together for the common interest, not direct small time personal gain.

  7. Alstradomus

    Blinded fundamental Christians continue to build their golden calf (Israel) thinking God will bless them. When Moses came down from the mountain his anger is just a spark compared to the tempest of rage awaitng America for financing this madness.

  8. Paul S

    Elaine: What is Saudi Arabia’s role in all this? I’ve always understood that there is a great deal of resentment by Iran towards the Saudis concerning OPEC oil production quotas, which are set by the Saudis. Aren’t the Saudis going to be the big winners if there is a shutdown of Iranian oil exports?

    ΩΩΩΩΩΩΩΩΩΩ

    ELAINE: Not if the Straits of Hormuz is closed.

  9. billibaldi

    Elaine,
    Please could you let people know that attacking Iran’s nuclear facilities sets precedent.

    Obviously Indian Point would be the prime target but a nice old plant like Oyster Creek or Brunswick would do nicely. Salem/Hope Island (3 for 1) is always a good alternative.

    Methods of attack, good old fashioned ICBM with a simple kinetic energy strike. (The Iranians have launched satellites.) The scarier alternative is the the cruise missiles (Tomahawk clones) launched out of a shipping container on a Liberian flagged container ship.

  10. These comments precisely define why we will lose the war against the Elites. United we would stand, but instead we are divided and will fall. Everyone is out to save his own behind.

  11. ‘They are the only nuclear armed nation on earth never investigated or examined by anyone. It is kept secret. This is the ONLY COUNTRY ON EARTH who did this.’

    Yes, they can manipulate the media and US Govt.

  12. CK

    I wonder how one closes the straits of Hormuz. Does one sink bunches of ships across the straits? Does one shoot missles at ships trying to transit the straits? Does one put a patrol boat in the middle of the straits with a BIG STOP SIGN on it?
    Or is it all a bunch of bloviating. There might be ways to increase the risk of transit for a day or three but that is about it. The straits cannot be physically stopped up, any attempts to shoot missles at passing ships will immediately disclose the locations of the launchers and Ka-Boom ( to use the militarily precise term ). Iran can indeed not ship oil to Europe. They have two choices: ship the oil somewhere other than europe or shut down the pumps and leave the crude sit in the ground until some sunnier future day.
    If the Iranians ship the european allotment to other buyers, the other buyers will turn around and sell the crude to the europeans anyway and at a higher price. Oil is fungible. Once its out of the ground and in the market it’s tough to stop it from going to the highest bidder.
    So if Iran decides that it doesn’t need to sell to the europeans directly, it can sell to the Russians and the russians can sell to the europeans with a generous markup for the russians efforts.

  13. Urban Roman

    Wasn’t that what the Bamster wanted? There’s nothing like removing a million or two barrels a day from the global mix, to drive up prices.

  14. CK

    If they just keep it in the ground, yes that drives the futures prices up and the pump prices simultaneously. If they just shuffle it through other sellers, no big deal, the buyers will cough up some extra scratch but the total amount available to sell stays the same. It is the buyer who always pays the price for sanctions.

  15. DeVaul

    CK,

    Perhaps you should review the Iraq-Iran War to see how they closed the straights. They only need to hit one oil tanker, which is not insured against missiles or war, and the rest stay in port. It’s just that simple. They don’t need to sink our fleet or even physically block the strait. Just one ship down and the tankers stop moving.

    Secondly, tankers were safe during the war because they were escorted by American flagged ships or were sailing under American flags. That will not work this time.

    Thirdly, Iran’s mobile missile launchers are probably single use trucks that will be abandoned right after they fire their missile, so we get to spend a million dollars to blow up an empty truck. I believe the Afghans specialize in this kind of warfare.

    Why would China sell oil to Europe? Which European Central Bank will allow China to take control of a Nato or EU country? Does China need euros or dollars? Does it need oil?

  16. emsnews

    It is laughably easy to stop oil from reaching its designation. A drunk captain can do it in minutes in Alaska. We see this all the time! I have a memory of this! Good lord, the only reason we are getting some oil from Iraq is only because Iran lets us. When they decide to not let us, they won’t let us.

    All it takes is removing just one more nation from oil exporting and boom! The rapacious billionaires who control oil futures markets will happily run up the price to the moon, at least over $200 a barrel, maybe unbuyable levels as Asia uses its immense FOREX holdings to buy up the oil and leave the EU high and dry.

  17. Christian W

    Those huge oil tankers are sitting ducks. Even an RPG could take one of them out. Take out ten of them in the Strait and the flow of oil will stop as there will be no shipping and the area will be a natural disaster zone.

    The Strait itself is very narrow, less than 50 kms in some places with the shipping lanes in the middle. Iran has hundreds of km’s of coastline from where to engage the tankers.

    And as Elaine point’s out if Iran is attacked the Iraqi oil lines go up in flames (and others across the ME).

  18. OC

    Another way would be to dump a ton of floating mines into the Strait and launch a few well placed terrorist attacks on the Saudi pipelines or oilfields and the race to US$200 a barrel of oil will start! The Iranians could stir up some shit in Libya and Europe will enjoy the pleasure of cold winter without heating!!

  19. CK

    The Exxon Valdez drunk captain did not stop oil from flowing to its destination, it stopped one ship load from reaching its destination. The ship that departed after the Valdez delivered on schedule.
    Insurance rates would go up if a ship were sunk or seriously damaged.
    The tankers would still move. The US navy would do escort duty, again, and some ships would be damaged but the goods would flow.
    Mine warfare, the US has quite a few vessels known as mine sweepers.
    Again a short disruption not a closure.
    Special op warfare by the non-existent Iranian Seals against saudi pipelines is a “pipedream.” Likewise their ability to strike deep into the heart of Iraq and sabotage the already sabotaged Iraqi pipelines. I also just don’t see how Iran “stirs up some shit” in Libya. It is more likely that the Libyan “freedom fighters” currently mucking about in Syria will be used to muck about in Iran by the US and Israel.

    Of all the options I do like the minewarfare thing the best. It is the poor man’s naval weapon. It doesn’t require a lot of big ships; merchant dhows can lay mines. Downside is that like RPGs, they don’t do a guaranteed kill, most times mines just piss people off.
    But I suppose if you believe that all the Shia are some monolithic bloc of idiots who will do whatever is the dumbest thing they can do to help the USA and Israel steal the Iranian patrimony then by all means enjoy your warsturbatory dreams.
    Consider that if the Iranian oil stops flowing to Europe, the Iraqis will benefit if they can flow more; they will not benefit if they flow none.
    Drinkin the kool aid of fear is fun, sorta like watching the scary movie through your spread fingers.
    And EMS is correct, the futures price of crude will go high and the Russians and Chinese will benefit.

  20. DeVaul

    Umm… my father was an insurance salesman and underwriter. Nothing is insured against missiles, mines, or anything to do with warfare. Rates do not go up after missile strikes because there is no payout to begin with. You lose a tanker to a missile, it’s your loss, not some insurance company’s loss.

    Iran has had 30 years to plan all this out, and it all centers on blocking a 50 mile wide strait. This is not an invasion of another country or continent. It is just them shutting down a waterway through their territory. Do you think we can keep the Suez Canal open if Egypt closes it?

    No special ops are needed. A barrage of missiles is enough to wreak total chaos on oil markets and stop any tanker captain from risking his life in a narrow strait while two countries fire missiles at each other.

    As for your fantasies of Murmansk Convoys rolling through the strait, uh… perhaps this is the KoolAid that Europe is drinking.

  21. Good luck sitting on a giant tanker brim full of OIL when the missiles and supersonic torpedoes start coming your way!

  22. Also the majority of Iraq is Shia, they know they will be untermenschen for the next two centuries if Iran is crushed. Iran will fight asymmetrically. What has been going on in Iraq and Afghanistan will come back at a much larger scale througout the ME.

  23. CK

    DeVaul: The Murmansk convoys did roll through even though thousands of ships were hit and damaged and sunk. Just as the US reflagged tankers during the Iraq/Iran war and escorted them through the straits. The same shit will be done next month or this summer or whenever the shit hits the fan.
    Tankers will be reflagged and commandered if necessary. Military vessels will offer themselves up as targets for missles and torpedos and mines, to protect the flow. Thieves do not bother with the small niceties when there is great wealth to be stolen.
    So the fact that your old man never underwrote a ship during wartime does not mean that ships will stay in port … they will sail and some will sink. The owners may or may not receive some recompense several decades down the road ( fully devoured by inflation of course ).
    Chris: Ships are a lot harder to sink, even ships loaded with crude, than you imagine. Unlike cruise ships off italy, tankers are carrying valuable cargo and are built to handle difficulties..
    And the shia are indeed a majority in numbers, and are popping out more little shia’s than their neighbours yearly ( a positive birth rate diffential directs the future demography unless the majority can be conned into allowing non majoritarian immigration to offset the differential.). Eventually Iraq will be 83% Shia ( sorta like the USA back in the day was 83% non-minority) boy won’t that be fun for the sunni minority and those dependable Israeli allies the Kurds? The assyrian christians, jews, gnostics and other minority religions that once populated Iraq having already been destroyed by the USA.
    However I do believe that whatever form of asymetrical emphasis the Iranian’s can employ; they will. I just don’t believe that they have much in the way of asymetrical at their disposal. They cannot even keep their own atomic scientists alive knowing that those scientists are actively targetted by others with a lot longer history of successful asymetry.
    I have read how the American Generals and other propagandists for war have blamed Iran for supplying the shaped charge knowhow that anyone with access to Wikipedia could find. That is not exactly competent Iranian asymetric warfare.
    Iran is a working democracy ( at least as much as the USA anyhow ), I suspect that if Iran is attacked, it will splinter just as the USA would. Every nation has its potential Quislings and Petains eager to assume the purple even if it is a short purple leash.

  24. But nations tend to pull together to defend against a foreign invader, especially if they see no good coming from an invasion. Iraq was split asunder with the Death Squad tactics honed in the South Americas (funny that the bombings targeting the Shia started when Negroponte came to Iraq isn’t it, and it all took off from there with revenge bombings and soon it was back and forth). Most normal Iraqi’s were horrified at the thought of a civil war, they had been intermarrying for generations.

    Israel however, has been aiming for decades to split the Muslim world into open conflict along the Sunni/Shia lines and any lines they can find. But what support would the west find in an attack on Iran in the ME, beyond the puppet regimes? I think an attack on Iran would galvanize a lot of people in the ME against Israel and the US. They have nothing to gain on being under the Zionist boot. The hornets nest of the ME hasn’t truly come alive yet, but it will if there is an attack on Iran. People sitting on the fence or having been passive would turn to active resistance, what do they have to lose?

  25. CK

    In a world that still encouraged letters of Marque and Reprisal, Negroponte’s name would be featured promintly.
    France did not “pull together” in WWII. Nor did Norway. The residents of the Ukraine did not pull together nor did the Poles. This idea that nations somehow override personal considerations is a bit of kool aid I do not find a lot of proof for. More than half the citizenry of the USA was AGAINST the Revolutionary war when it started. They did not “pull together”‘. They worked for the rebels to be defeated. When the rebels won many of those who backed the losing side moved back to England or up to Canada. Had the rebels lost, those loyalists would have been the Crown Governors, the Queen’s Representatives for the colonies. The Iraqis who backed the USA are still waiting for their visas but then so are the Vietnamese who thought they USA was more profitable deal than the NVA and chose the USA side for the chance to wear the purple leash of the Americans.
    Israel is not a good neighbour. Having her for a neighbour is almost as devastating as having the USA as an ally.
    The US State department earlier this week told the Pakistani government that it should cancel the Iran Pakistan natural gas pipeline. The US State department this week told the Pakistan government that it should cut its throat for Israel. Two weeks ago the USA moved against two smallish Chinese oil firms for working with Iran. After the USA kicked out the Libyan government the first thing on the free nation of Libya’s agenda was to cancel the oil contracts they had with the Chinese government. China is a lot of things but it is not stupid. China is the target for the USA just like a successful and prosperous Lebanon and a sectarian Syria are the targets for Israel. China knows this. Anything else is the magician’s big booded assistant; the distraction.
    If the USA can not reign in/destroy/isolate China, China will be the world’s strongest economy within ten years. China is currently an economy based on making STUFF. People cannot live on derivatives and insurance policies and options on bets on mortgages. People do live on and need STUFF. The USA is no longer a Stuff maker and if you notice, all the bad shit about derivatives and such never mention the Chinese holding any of the crap.
    I don’t know that chinese bankers are all that much smarter than american and english bankers ( I suspect they are but only because I know several US bankers ) but the chinese invented gambling and the rigged gambling games over 4000 years ago. They have seen more crap than the American greedboys have thought up yet.

  26. JT

    It’s takes a lot to sink a ship.

  27. DeVaul

    CK,

    I don’t believe anyone has ever guarranteed the cargo of any ship sailing through a war zone. It is standard boilerplate legalese on every insurance policy. It falls under the “acts of god” paragraph.

    If the Germans and Italians could not get their fleet through the Straits of Gibraltar during WW II, then nothing is getting through the Hormuz no matter how many ships and sailors “volunteer” to “offer themselves up as targets”(?!?!). How many destroyers do we even have now? I think Britain has one.

    Missiles do not take notice of flags, especially modern ones, and unlike before, those launching them will do so in the knowledge that every vessel passing through is an enemy combatant. No selective firing is necesssary.

    My Murmansk statement was a joke. If you think that a convoy will get through an area where there is no secrecy, where they can be hit from hundreds of miles away, where there is no room to manouver in a 25 mile wide shipping channel, all while leaning over the rail looking for mines, then I don’t really have anything more to say.

  28. JT

    War will start in march.

  29. CK

    1) The whole world is now a war zone according to the US government as specifically codified in the latest NDAA. Force Majeure can be invoked by any insurer that wants to anywhere at anytime for anything.
    2) Necessary materials for the war effort will be moved no matter what the cost.
    3) Without seaborne crude the war sputters to a halt so does the USA and Europe.
    4) The straits can not be closed and will not be closed. If the tanker owners will not move the goods, the tanker owners will be expropriated of their tankers and the goods will flow anyhow. They can sue for payment in paper dollars after the war on terrrorism is won ( That will be the 12th of Never for those wanting a time horizon ). There will be no guarantee of any specific ship or its cargo, the oil will flow because it has too. There is no alternative.

    5) The English managed to get through from Gibraltar to Alexandria in the face of Regina Marina and Luftwaffe interdiction. The Nazis and Italians managed a few convoys from Naples to Africa in the face of Royal Navy and RAF interdiction.
    6) There is no secracy for either side. From satellites to drones to over the horizon radar, the Iranians are in a fishbowl. Certainly the Persian gulf is a bit constricted, but that just means it is easier to find the guys trying to shoot at you.
    5) JT we were talking about VLCC not rowboats, yes an well aimed RPG can damage a Somali small craft. Well aimed .50 cal will take down a cigarette boat. Neither will do much against a VLCC.

  30. DeVaul

    “Certainly the Persian gulf is a bit constricted, but that just means it is easier to find the guys trying to shoot at you.”

    LOL… this is Orwellian!

  31. emsnews

    Good lord! Back during WWII, the US built around 90% of the naval ships used by the allies in that war and 80% of the aircraft used by the allies and today? Do we have ship yards? And steel mills???? Where are THEY???

    Ain’t got them! We have very little ability to build many ships and we build NO supertankers. Guess who does build these? Who has the most ship building ability? CHINA! And other Asian powers!!!

    No, we are doomed just like England that can’ build a tug boat without strain.

    The Chinese have missiles we can’t stop that can sink aircraft carriers with one hit. The Pentagon knows this which is why they are toying with the idea of a Japanese-style kamikaze nuclear strike to take down China suddenly. But China and Russia know this and are taking very strong measures against this and it is impossible for the US to win a nuclear war, you can bet, all of our nuclear power plants are targets for take downs which will mean, our nation will die slowly or fast depending on how close (NYC is doomed, totally, and utterly!).

    This is all very insane stuff and igniting religious wars is stupid beyond belief. We should avoid this like the plague, not encourage it.

  32. CK

    @DeVaul That was not ORWELLIAN that was Military Mindset.
    @EMS: If the pols leading a nation believe that they will survive a nuclear war and the rest of the world won’t. Then there will be war.

  33. DeVaul

    “…that was Military Mindset.”

    Ok, now THAT… that I will agree to.

  34. “the oil will flow because it has too. There is no alternative.”

    That was pretty funny.

    No doubt there are people who think the flow of manufactured imports will continue even after the US dollar loses most of its value. Because people just have to keep shipping that stuff to America. It’s in their blood.

  35. CK

    Steve
    There might be alternatives to the american suburban, paper pushing, SUV driving lifestyle that do not require refined crude.
    Without the crude, the US goes dark and cold and motionless quickly.
    The US military which is the biggest user of refined crude will not be allowed to go motionless, flightless, anchored in port. That will not be allowed to happen as long as the USA has the most guns and can steal the most stuff.
    It is not about the flow of manufactured goods from other countries, currently it is easier to steal that flow with paper, but the US will steal the flow of oil with whatever it has when it becomes necessary. That sir is the logic of empire.
    The US empire can survive the lack of flat screen tv and hyundais, it can’t survive the lack of crude.

  36. CK, there’s something to your argument. If the people at the top of the US government are literally insane with lust for power (or can convince other leaders that they are) then enough oil would have to be given to them to keep their F-21s flying.

    I don’t think they are that insane, though. They seem to be quite ‘rational’ in the economics sense of the term: interested in personal wealth above all else.

    That’s how the USSR collapsed gracefully. The top guys were allowed to loot the country, in exchange for going quietly. The european ‘Great Powers,’ including Britain, difacto transferred control of their colonies to the US after WW II. So the logic doesn’t always play out violently.

    I think the American leaders will quite happily loot America in exchange for going quietly. It’s what they’ve been doing anyway, for the past thirty years. Just give them the chance to do it once more on a huge scale, and they’ll retire happy as pigs in shit.

  37. Hm, that was a bit too harsh of me. In fairness to pigs, they only destroy the planet slowly. I’ll take them any day of the week over brilliant, ideologically-motivated apes.

  38. emsnews

    Boars are wild pigs and they are dangerous, hardy and above all, SMART.

  39. CK

    Were the crude to stop flowing to the USA, within a week the food riots start, within a month the current crop of elected thieves, appointed thieves and non productive “public employees” who allowed the crude to stop flowing would be hung. It is not insane to take whatever actions one finds necessary to keep ones life and ones position.

  40. “It is not insane to take whatever actions one finds necessary to keep ones life and ones position.”

    That way lies Nazism.

    But what you say is true in a way. It has been the US policy to protect the flow of oil from the Strait of Hormuz since Carter at least.

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