Cigarette And Liquor Stamp Taxes: Why Garner Had To Be Arrested And Why Cops Couldn’t Back Down


We have yet another rage over a police death of someone who was resisting arrest and not cooperating with the police.  Like all the other cases so far that have black politicians and leaders in a rage, the person involved, Mr. Garner of Staten Island, NYC, was breaking the law and more importantly, resisting arrest.  There is this fine line that is quite obvious between resisting arrest/running away from arrest and the amount of force needed by police to make an arrest.  In the case of Garner, he used his super size to force the police to put him under physical restraint because he even said, he was tired of being arrested.  The fact is, he was always breaking the law each time he was arrested.


The man was selling illegal cigarettes in front of a store selling legal ones, cheap.  He was taking away business from a legal tax paying store and the store was continuously calling the police to stop him, he would go to jail, get out and do it again to the same store owner.  Many times this happened and finally, when the police tried to arrest him the last time, he said he was tired of being arrested and was going to stand his ground and sell illegal cigarettes so he dared the police to stop arresting him and let him break the law.


The police didn’t intend to kill him, he died of a heart attack.  Of course, there is a huge, huge segment of the black population that wants no laws.  Period.  Many are quite content with driving out everyone else and having a crime zone like Detroit where they can do as they please and there is no one stopping anything.  We call these zones ‘slums’.


But first, let’s talk about the cigarette taxes.  Cigarettes are very bad for the health.  Tobacco is more dangerous than pot.  Pot, like any drug, is dangerous when driving but so is legal liquor, for example.  Liquor is dangerous for the health and can be addictive like tobacco and was briefly made illegal in the 1920’s.  Today, like cigarettes, it is heavily taxed and if you use it and drive a vehicle, you can be arrested and put in prison.


Selling liquor without paying the taxes on it is also illegal.  These taxes were all imposed by the citizens, not the State, via various mechanisms and people who are not addicts have greatly approved of these taxes which mainly go towards schools and thus, alleviate the tax burden on home owners.


Indian tribes in places like New York don’t pay any of these taxes and people go to reservations here to buy these things.  Many times, they bring the booty home and sell it to neighbors with a small mark up…but they do this quietly at home and don’t do it to the whole neighborhood.  Dealers of illegal stuff are all over our slums which because there is little police presence, not more presence.  After all these demonstrations and riots, I am betting the little patrolling happening today will decline to zero.


Cigarette and tobacco products tax for the state of NY:


Taxes on cigarettes

New York State imposes an excise tax on cigarettes at the rate of $4.35 per package of twenty cigarettes. New York City imposes a local excise tax at the rate of $1.50 per package of twenty cigarettes, bringing the combined tax rate in New York City to $5.85.

The excise tax is paid when a licensed cigarette stamping agent purchases New York State tax stamps and affixes them to the bottom of each pack of cigarettes sold in New York State as evidence that the state excise tax was paid. A joint New York State/New York City tax stamp is evidence that both the state and city excise taxes were paid. In addition to the excise tax, a prepaid sales tax is paid by the agent at the time the cigarette tax stamps are purchased.

Taxes on other tobacco products

New York State also imposes an excise tax on tobacco products at the following rates:

75% of the wholesale price on cigars and tobacco products (other than little cigars and snuff);
$4.35 per twenty little cigars; and
$2 per container of snuff one ounce or less, and $2 per ounce and a proportionate rate on any fractional amount thereof for containers with more than one ounce.
Licensing requirements for cigarette agents and wholesalers

You must be licensed as a cigarette agent to purchase and affix New York State cigarette tax stamps. Cigarette agent licenses may be issued to:

dealers (wholesalers or retailers) who:
· maintain separate warehousing facilities for receiving and distributing cigarettes and conducting their business, and
· have received commitments from at least two cigarette manufacturers whose aggregate market share is at least 40% of the New York State market.
importers, exporters, or manufacturers of cigarettes, and
certain other businesses dealing in unstamped cigarettes.
You must be licensed as a wholesale dealer of cigarettes if you intend to sell to a retail dealer or other persons for the purpose of resale.


Garner could have sold his cigarettes under the table at home.  He could have gone to an empty street corner where all the homes have been burned or vandalized and sold them there, too.  But he wanted frequent business so he stood in front of a legal store to do these sales.  If you sell ANYTHING on the street, food, toys, clothing, while not collecting taxes and do this in front of ANY store selling these same things and paying taxes, you WILL be arrested.


Here is an example of a state raising more tax money for schools this way: How can we expect a cigarette tax to pay for Philly schools, when we also expect it to discourage smokers? | News and Opinion | Philadelphia Weekly


The eternally burning question: How do we find the money to keep Philly’s collapsing schools running after the Corbett administration’s budget cuts? The most recent answer: Let’s add a Philly-only cigarette tax and use that new money.


If only it were that easy.


After more than a year of debate, a $2-per-pack tax on cigarettes passed the House this spring, passed the Senate (twice) and has received verbal support from Gov. Tom Corbett. All this is vital; local governments can only raise such taxes if they have the state’s support.


The other reason for this tax is health:


Philadelphia has one of the highest rates of adult smoking and obesity in the U.S., according to a 2014 Community Health Assessment study. That’s bad. But the past 10 years have seen a 15 percent reduction in adult smoking. The government claims its educational and advertorial efforts deserve the credit for that.


Today, just 23.3 percent of Philadelphians smoke. This is higher than the 18 percent national average, but actually the smallest percentage the state has seen since smoking data has been tallied. The declining rate is a nationwide trend that’s has seen massive victories over the last decade, the most obvious of which are indoor (and some outdoor) smoking bans.


Both New York City and Philadelphia tried to also tax pop drinks that have lots of corn syrup for health reasons, too. But public resistance to this halted the attempt.   In the past there was a Stamp Act Revolt.  It was because the tax was imposed from London and no one in the colonies had any say in the taxation.  Thus the ‘taxation without representation’ business.


Right after the revolution we had the The Whiskey Rebellion which was a tax to pay for the costs of the Revolutionary War.


President Washington sought to resolve this dispute peacefully. In 1792, he issued a national proclamation admonishing westerners for their resistance to the “operation of the laws of the United States for raising revenue upon spirits distilled within the same.”2 However, by 1794 the protests became violent. In July, nearly 400 whiskey rebels near Pittsburgh set fire to the home of John Neville, the regional tax collection supervisor. Left with little recourse and at the urgings of Secretary Hamilton, Washington organized a militia force of 12,950 men and led them towards Western Pennsylvania, warning locals “not to abet, aid, or comfort the Insurgents aforesaid, as they will answer the contrary at their peril.”3


The calling of the militia had the desired effect of essentially ending the Whiskey Rebellion. By the time the militia reached Pittsburgh, the rebels had dispersed and could not be found. The militia apprehended approximately 150 men and tried them for treason. A paucity of evidence and the inability to obtain witnesses hampered the trials. Two men, John Mitchell and Philip Weigel, were found guilty of treason, though both were pardoned by President Washington.


Making slavery illegal was much more violent.  This was a case of farmers and manufacturers in the South using cheap slave labor to compete with free labor up North.  This was resolved VERY violently and many people died.  And the South to this day, whites there hate the North for stopping this noxious form of labor!  And blacks are still angry about being made to work for free, too and this is also very understandable.


When someone defies authority, if resistance is high for whatever reason and Mr. Garner thought his immense bulk would prevent arrest and therefore, he would be able to defy the State and break the law due to his sheer size, if resistance is high, the response will rise, too or the State falls.  There are always new generations that imagine a revolution will stop taxes.


This was true in the US from day one!  The people who didn’t want to pay any whiskey taxes were typical.  They thought someone else would be taxed.  The rich do this too!  When our oligarchs took over the government, they began with Ronnie Reagan to cut their own taxes to the bone.  They have gotten very, very rich doing this while our government goes deeper and deeper into debt and other taxes shoot upwards.


This can lead to revolutionary actions but it will NOT stop taxation.  No post-revolution government has no taxes unless the country becomes a failed state like say, Libya after NATO attacked or any other nation targeted by the CIA and Mossad.  Someone has to pay taxes.  School taxes are based on property values and property in slums drops to near zero so the contribution towards funding schools collapses.


States that see this process like say, Michigan, also see suburbs refusing to be taxed to pay for city schools for a wide variety of reasons.  Mostly due to feeling that this is good money going after bad money into a rat hole.  No one dares talk about this openly in politics because this means confronting all the many reasons why white people flee black neighborhoods to stay alive and have their children learn anything in school.


The liberal response is to attack whites for fleeing even as liberals, once they have children themselves, do likewise.  This is why young, childless people can still flock to cities but when they have a school age child and can’t afford private schools in cities, they pick up and leave.


The super rich have moved most of our production overseas seeking cheap labor and have left a huge population shiftless and worthless.  No one really wants to interact with this population which is viewed as a monster to be avoided.  Middle class black families teeter on the edge of all this because when they move to good schools and no street thugs, things begin to deteriorate and they end up surrounded by black thugs eventually unless they also move outwards in this frantic attempt at avoiding criminals and finding good schools.


This is VERY EXPENSIVE for middle class people.  The value of their homes in good school districts that are mostly white or Asian shoots upwards to the sky while homes in black neighborhoods collapse to near or at zero.  We do not fix this dynamic via race riots.  Former NAACP leader accuses Sharpton and Jackson of ‘exploiting’ Trayvon Martin | The Daily Caller


Former NAACP leader C.L. Bryant is accusing Jesse Jackson and Al Sharpton of “exploiting” the Trayvon Martin tragedy to “racially divide this country.”


“His family should be outraged at the fact that they’re using this child as the bait to inflame racial passions,” Rev. C.L. Bryant said in a Monday interview with The Daily Caller.


The conservative black pastor who was once the chapter president of the Garland, Texas NAACP called Jackson and Sharpton “race hustlers” and said they are “acting as though they are buzzards circling the carcass of this young boy.”


The heads of the New Black Panthers and the Nation of Islam have both openly called for a race war which they really, seriously and very stupidly think they will win via rampaging out of the slums and running into middle class neighborhoods to terrorize and kill white families.  Instead of the slow burn and kill which targets whites, it will be a mass attack.


Which will last a very short time.  Not due to blacks winning but due to whites finally slamming down hard on blacks in general.


“The epidemic is truly black on black crime,” Bryant said. “The greatest danger to the lives of young black men are young black men.”

Bryant said he wishes civil rights leaders were protesting those problems.

“Why not be angry about the wholesale murder that goes on in the streets of Newark and Chicago?” he asked. “Why isn’t somebody angry about that six-year-old girl who was killed on her steps last weekend in a cross fire when two gang members in Chicago start shooting at each other? Why is there no outrage about that?”


The US and Israel both have problems with social structures but are opposite each other.  The US has genuinely tried to make laws and customs so that racism would be stopped and people would have equal chances in life while Israel has gone full Nazi.  Israel is quite popular in the US and the US media works hard to insure this and a huge part of this popularity is due to Jews discriminating against Muslim natives, dispossessing them and killing them!!!  Which means this can and will happen here if things continue to deteriorate.


Blacks cannot be content to keep making slums and enlarging this home bases.  Whites should blame rich white people for refusing to pay taxes and for offshoring all our jobs and bringing in a flood of illegal aliens.  The rich have designed this disaster, not blacks.  Rich whites are avoiding their obligations to our nation, not black citizens.


Black citizens are caught in this downward cycle of despair as jobs vanish and the only means of production left to them is to defy the state and sell illegal stuff on the streets.


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29 responses to “Cigarette And Liquor Stamp Taxes: Why Garner Had To Be Arrested And Why Cops Couldn’t Back Down

  1. e sutton

    Thanks for giving a very thorough, thoughtful, and sane analysis of this. I was thinking the exact same thing, vis a vis Israel and how it treats the Palestinians. Blacks, in my opinion of course, are the Palestinians here, constantly on the frontline of abuse by the corporate sponsored state. Now we have a problem. It’s not just blacks who have drawn a line in the sand, but many, many of their white lib counterparts.

    Eric Holder and Barack Obama have openly encouraged class/racial warfare. The two of them make me sick to my stomach and are the antithesis of what I would call “leaders”. My argument with the Garner case is, yes, he was breaking the law, but when we see behavior that in historical times has brought down civilizations (the dismantling of banking rules and safeguards) but a black man who’s as easily and readily squashed like a cockroach, something about “rule of law” in this country rings completely hollow. This, for me, is what the Garner case is all about. Right or wrong, people have taken these cases to heart as a moment of awakening. Please correct me if I’m wrong.

    Leonard Pitts had a column today about “white privilege”. I can barely stand to read him anymore, as he sits mightily atop a throne of “Affirmative Action” and passes down life lessons on how evil YT is. If “white privilege” means I don’t have to live around negroes, yes, I am completely and thoroughly GUILTY as charged. That may make me “rayciss”. So be it. I’ve worked too long and too hard to see my property value decimated by these creatures. If that means chasing (white) dog owners off my property when they let their dog poop in my yard (I’ve repeatedly done this) then so be it.

  2. e sutton

    OT (courtesy RT)

    Vlad Putin tell it like it is:

    “I’ve mentioned our American friends for a good reason,” Putin said. “Because sometimes you don’t even know to whom it is better to talk to: the governments of certain countries or directly with their American patrons.”

    😀 News you won’t see on CNN!

  3. emsnews

    Yes, but the ‘fix’ is going to be…NO RULE OF ANY LAWS in select neighborhoods!

    That is, the damn slums. Since these places will now be extremely highly dangerous and note that all race riots burn down the towns after the cops flee!….people who accidentally enter these no go zones will be killed and robbed and no one will lift a finger to save them.

    Newark is like that. People go way out of their way to avoid even driving through Newark. Detroit is actively avoided all together these days! Who goes there anymore???

    Alas, the slums will be slummier and the spiral downwards for black communities will worsen and this is all very sad and obvious to me but people who are tired of the cops enforcing the laws will get their wishes…and remember, all wishes are actually curses.

    The rich wished to pay no taxes and got that, for example. The end result will be a collapse of society and the end of our little empire but they can’t see the end result any more than blacks can see the end result of choosing amorality.

  4. Christian W

    Well, cops are only enforcing laws that suit the elites. Obviously the cops should enforce laws including on the elites, and themselves.

    This post is both a bit OT and not OT, because I believe you cannot solve the “black slum issue” without solving the elite issue. Nothing, especially now in this modern super connected world, exists independently of anything else.

    The Kiev Ukrainians have appointed foreigners into their government. Their new finance minister is a Vulture fund manager… Like in the UK the new policies will be privatization of public assets for private profit. Their new economy minister is a investment banker. Their new health minister is a Georgian/US mole. Etc.

    The elites are now openly destroying nations and moving in for private profiteering.

    The US used nazis as a battering ram to tear down the government in Ukraine just as they are using far right wing extremist Wahabis to smash Syria and Iraq to pieces. Right wing extremism is very obviously on the rise in Europe, for the same old historical reasons financial difficulties and now as a reaction against floods of illegal aliens and open border ‘aliens’ and refugee ‘aliens’. Trafficking is becoming a huge business in Africa.

    So, let’s move these policies to the US. Who would benefit from the US flipping into kill the minorities mode? What do the the “black community” win on going into ISIS mode? The elites would simply entrench themselves even further. Besides, I wonder if such operations is simply the FBI moving out of nonsensical “terrorist” baiting/entrapment operations into an area with much more “bite” for the middle class.

    All of this is a political problem at heart. The “black community” cannot solve it alone, because, just like for the “white community” at a certain level their leaders disappear into the elite machine.

  5. Petruchio

    e Sutton: thank you for sharing that Putin quote. It is a sad but true and accurate statement of fact. I like the (fictitious, but still accurate) quote of the foreign leader who gets a call from Barack Obama. The foreign leader’s response is, “Quit wasting my time and put Jamie Dimon on the phone!”

  6. Christian W

    Speaking of the elite machine. The Guardian (and HuffPo eg) is without doubt a key piece in that setup. It stands for the supposed “liberal” position, but like the “liberals” Elaine rail against – it is completely fake.

    Here is an interesting piece by a journalist/blogger whose contract was terminated with immediate effect by The Guardian because he dared highlight the deeper strategic thinking behind Israel’s attack on Gaza and highlight Israel’s theft of Palestinian energy resources.

    View at

    As another former Guardian journalist, Jonathan Cook explains it :

    “The Guardian, like other mainstream media, is heavily invested — both financially and ideologically — in supporting the current global order. It was once able to exclude and now, in the internet age, must vilify those elements of the left whose ideas risk questioning a system of corporate power and control of which the Guardian is a key institution.

    The paper’s role, like that of its rightwing cousins, is to limit the imaginative horizons of readers. While there is just enough leftwing debate to make readers believe their paper is pluralistic, the kind of radical perspectives needed to question the very foundations on which the system of Western dominance rests is either unavailable or is ridiculed.”

    This is of course why media in the US and UK are so heavily censored.

    Can you imagine someone like Elaine being allowed to rattle the cage and challenge the official nonsense on a number of topics [read a number of critical propaganda pushes] directly?

  7. Christian W

    Hm, broken link, trying again.

    View at

  8. Christian W

    Weirdness I’m just copy pasting the url as usual but it doesn’t work. Go to for and check out:

    ‘Palestine is not an environment story’

  9. e sutton

    @Christian W
    Thanks. Informationclearinghouse is a great go to source. I’d like to see Elaine get posted there which would no doubt add to her (much needed) exposure.

  10. ziff

    there is no ‘rule of law’ now , only the rule of the lawless. i’m referrring to ‘civil fortfeiture’ , among other egregious gov abuses. Never a word about that here.

  11. melponeme_k

    The elites newspapers really could have cared less about comments in the early days. They let people squabble among themselves. What did get their goat were people like Elaine challenging stories with comments full of facts.

    But the real shutdown occurred after an incident that showed the true power of the internet as a forum for action and opinion. That was when New Yorkers stood up and prevented La Kennedy from being crowned NY Senator with no past experience in such a role.

    In that once instance the elites knew what the populace thought, knew that the populace did not like them nor want their leadership and they could not afford future incidents of the same.

    If the La Kennedy debacle had occurred today, she would get that seat. Simply because those of us who protested would have no online forum to fight the propaganda.

  12. CK

    Theft often leads to murder. Calling the theft “taxes” doesn’t change the aroma or the results.
    Would Mr. Garner be selling onesies if the tax on packs of smokes were 0?
    No theft = no market = no dead man.
    The government steals from smokers because it wants smokers to quit? Not true. Thought experiment: how much theft would the state gather if every smoker quit today. $0 tomorrow. The states do NOT want folks to quit smoking the states want smoking to continue so as to reap the stolen gains.

    However as folks are wont to do, many folks have given up tobacco. Government cigarette theft revenue has decreased, so the government raises the rate of theft. As you increase the theft rate of a thing, you create markets to avoid the theft entirely. This is not exactly rocket science, it is basic human nature.
    But it’s all good, the states will legalize and tax Marijuana and so will the FedGov. And we have imported the market and the marketers to make the Marijuana industry muy profitable for the various organized thieves guilds you call government and mafia and cartels.


    ELAINE: There is no society that doesn’t tax. There are primitive tribal societies that don’t ‘tax’ but they also don’t allow the concept of private property, either. 🙂

  13. Pontiff Holysh*t

    The medical examiner determined that Garner’s death was the result of homicide. Therefore, as long as the medical examiner is available to testify, the causation element does not seem to be a likely obstacle to a finding of probable cause. Those choke-holds are prohibited, and for good reason.

    But regardless of whether this case in fact provides a clear example, the fact that police never seem to be held criminally accountable even when it is clearly justified at least makes it somewhat understandable why the black community is incredulous whenever a police officer is exonerated in the killing of a black person.

  14. emsnews

    This is why: the minute you begin punishing cops hard for hazards of dealing with people who refuse to be arrested or are violent…the police cease arresting violent people.

    Since most of these live in the slums, the slums won’t see cops anymore and I have LIVED THROUGH THIS IN THE PAST.

    It is ugly. We had bodies shot dead in our schools, on the streets, in the homes, there was so much guns going off, when I was arguing with Mayor Koch of NYC on 5th Avenue in Brooklyn about all this, two drug dealers did a shoot out right down the street and Koch jumped like a scared rabbit and took off while I yelled at him.

    I wanted my cops and that day, I finally got them. We cleaned up the street. The only ones who complained were radical white middle class dudes who were brain dead and…the drug dealers most of whom were black, their customers were mainly white dudes.

  15. e sutton


    If marijuana was legal, I would cheer. North Carolina was a huge tobacco state. It is now a mere shadow of its former glory. Thus, we’ve lost a significant amount of tax revenue due to declines in smoking worldwide. Our soil is perfect for growing marijuana. All our fiscal problems would instantly be solved, we would reap huge tax benefits, and our unemployment rate would plummet. So what do we here from our (Republican) governor on all this? Silence. Deafening silence. Nary a word from the libs either. So what to glean from this silence? Perhaps the War on Drugs is more profitable. Bottom line, in this state and all others, the objective seems to be theft, financialization, profit skimming, and Ponzi schemes are the way to make money, not manufacturing and not investing in what used to be the United States.

    That brings us to Russia. Russia is sitting on a huge deposit of natural gas and oil. Putin is actively creating partnerships with those countries outside of the European vassal states, trading with China, which has, courtesy of the traitors in Congress, all of the manufacturing base that use to be in America. Russia is a sovereign state, dedicated to building the country and its people into prosperity.

    Now, contrast Russia with the U.S. What does the U.S. have? Fiat currency which, at present, is internationally accepted via mandate as the Reserve currency of the world, a huge standing army scattered all over the globe, massive amounts of aging nuclear weapons, supreme arrogance and a shocking lack of tactful diplomacy, bordering on adolescent school boy taunts and jeers. Russia, on the other hand, is rich in natural resources, has a geographically strategic locale, and a disciplined, for the most part sober, homogenous citizenry. Russia is led by a cool, mature, somewhat detached, intelligent, diplomatic statesman as its leader.

    I don’t know about you, but I know where my money would be on which country to bet on. And I’d trade that steaming pile of excrement we have parked in the White House now in a New York minute for one Vladimir Putin.


    ELAINE: YES. Again.

    Everyone: you are all just amazing. Yes, we are in this literal matrix and yes, our rulers want a race war because they are not blacks. And yes, they think this will make them more powerful only…they are on the side of the black thug community which is crazy! Yikes. A mistake our elites made more than once in the past. History is littered with the severed heads of the very rich and powerful.

  16. Christian W

    This is why: the minute you begin punishing cops hard for hazards of dealing with people who refuse to be arrested or are violent…the police cease arresting violent people.

    Sorry, but police are not being punished for ‘hazards’ if they murder other people, they are being punished for murder/manslaughter or whatever may have happened when they broke the rules. No need for euphemisms. Even so it is extremely rare for cops to be punished in the US from my understanding.

    But I see your point. It’s a dangerous, thankless job. Especially in an environment with so many guns and drugged and crazy people. Still that doesn’t mean you can let police get away with murder to make their job easier, otherwise you will have what we are starting to see now, police simply solving all ‘problems’ (real or imagined) with the gun.

    You seem to be saying that is acceptable. I have no problem with the police cleaning out streets and putting drug dealers in jail. But that has to happen within the law, just like you had to operate within the law.

    The US police force doesn’t exactly have a spotless record.

    Torture Inc.

    A video from ‘the other side’ that highlights police brutality (warning: extremely graphic). But you can see why maybe some people aren’t so keen on being arrested. Are these cops your friendly neighborhood cops “dealing with people”?


    ELAINE: NO cops will arrest ANYONE resisting arrest if this means they, themselves will go to prison if they have to kill the criminals or accidentally kill them while wrestling with these guys.

    So the ONLY solution is the one they used in the past: ignore it all and only protect quiet, non-violent neighborhoods while ignoring the gross crimes including outright open looting and arson of the hoods. I lived in that! I fought hard to bring the police back into action again.

    The alternative, as I told Mayor Koch, was to put up machine gun nests and guards to gun down strangers! You cannot live like that. Or rather, I could if I was angry enough and desperate enough. Luckily, the cops decided to fight for me and we took back the hood from the thugs.

  17. aashild

    I understand why police sometimes have to apply force, but this video shows police officers beating people repeatedly, and throwing them recklessly towards the wall or floor.

    It should not be necessary to be so be so violent.

  18. emsnews

    Correct. But then we live in a violent society where authority is NOT allowed when children grow up….what I mean is how our schools are run.

    Today, children run wild in schools and then grow up thinking everyone is going to riot all the time over everything possible, no self control. The police go to these same violent schools and are degraded by it all, too.

    So the violent meet the violent and…they go all nuts, from top to bottom.

    Imagine if we had schools where children had to behave in a civilized manner and be polite. Shocking idea, right?

    But we opted for the opposite.

  19. Christian W

    @16 Elaine’s comment.

    I see that problem with the cops stopping to arrest if they risk getting smacked by the law themselves. But there has to be a balance between doing real police work and becoming trigger happy and violent, no? If you take police ‘lawlessness’ too far towards the other end you also end up in a bad place, probably even worse place because how do you get out of that trap once the police do as they please? Rotten police in a rotten economy is not a good recipe.

    We are not in the 1970’s anymore. The entire US is crumbling now and to me it looks like the US is on the road to a brutal police state. If the law is 100% geared toward protecting only the elite and a small “liberal” middle class scared to death propping it up (as long as they behave as the elites tell them to or the police comes knocking) you get Egypt.

  20. Christian W

    The new finance minister of Ukraine is a former US State department employee. I’m worried about Ukraine because if the elites succeed there they will use the same looting template on nation after nation in the EU, starting with the poor Eastern Bloc nations.

    The Ukrainian police refused to shoot the maidan demonstrators, even as they were being killed. That is going too far in the other direction obviously and failing to protect the very fabric of society. As a result we have the insane elites in charge there now. Now you bet THIS TIME, the police would shoot instantly, even as the US/western elites were saying the opposite during the maidan demonstrations.

  21. emsnews

    The US government demands no police actions to stop demonstrations our rulers WANT.

    The demonstrations our rulers want STOPPED are stopped quite violently and the US media doesn’t say a peep. Like Operation Wall Street: got near ZERO friendly coverage from our media while this rage against the cops in general, is allowed to violently vent itself so long as the neighborhoods being burned down are lower class.

    If these riots hit Wall Street, the rioters will be killed with the press cheering this carnage!

  22. aashild

    Absolutely Elaine. There is a total lack of respect for authority among many children and youths in today’s society. This is also true in my country. I have always been of the opinion that discipline is healthy for children.

  23. e sutton

    While a teacher I was told by a student that I wasn’t entitled to respect. Respect, she told me, was something “earned”. Fifth grade. Do I really need to tell you what race? Feel free to jump in here, anyone. I’m open to all opinions (or none, as the case may be :)) .

  24. Petruchio

    Maybe it’s just me, but I can still recall the Rodney King video of the cops taking him down. King was tasered twice and still didn’t go down. King was a convicted felon. Kind of convenient that someone just so happened to be there AND have a video camera to record this? To make a martyr out of Rodney King is shocking, imho.

  25. Luke

    e sutton, many of us have ‘negro fatigue’ but some who do will not admit that they have it. EMS points out why one would have it. The media ignores the color of crime.

  26. emsnews

    I am fighting for black rights!

    And telling the truth: morals matter. Morals work. Every looting expedition has a brief moment of joy thanks to getting goodies for free but this is followed by utter destruction as the arson, the killing and the vandalism rises higher and higher and neighbors loot the loot.

    Sad, I saw all this first hand in NYC in 1977.

  27. John

    Another fantastic article and equally fantastic discussion thread. If I tried to respond to all of it, the post would look like an encyclopedia. But a few things stand out.

    Making slavery illegal was much more violent. This was a case of farmers and manufacturers in the South using cheap slave labor to compete with free labor up North.

    this was actually only half of the problem. The other half was that the Federal government, at the behest of the northern manufacturers, imposed high tariffs on goods the Southern states were importing from Europe and England, so that the foreign goods were more costly than the domestic. This is a fine example of pre-Civil War crony capitalism.

    The Southern apologists love to point out only the punitive tariffs. The Northern apologists love to point out only slavery. The truth, as usual, is a combination of complex factors where all sides share a sizeable amount of blame.

    The heads of the New Black Panthers and the Nation of Islam have both openly called for a race war which …will last a very short time. Not due to blacks winning but due to whites finally slamming down hard on blacks in general.

    I’m pretty sure I’ve talked about this here on this blog before, and I’m glad to see that you’ve been persuaded to this view. The black population, with their gang-bangers wielding “Glocks and Uzis” are no match for the suburban and rural folks. Especially the rural folks, who are shooting BB guns at age 2, .22 rifles at age 5, and by 8 – 10 years of age, can use their 30-06 rifles to “pick a fly off their coon dog’s ass at 500 feet…without waking up the dog.”

    The race war that Obama and Sharpton are trying to start will be a complete massacre for Blacks, if it were ever to succeed. It’s not that a lot of Whites won’t die, as they certainly will. But the Black population will be largely wiped out.

    Christian W

    Well, cops are only enforcing laws that suit the elites. Obviously the cops should enforce laws including on the elites, and themselves.

    Absolutely. This gets back to my point about limiting government power. They must not be allowed to exempt themselves from the laws prohibiting the wronging of others. As government power grows, the twin phenomena of picking winners and losers via oppressive regulation, and exempting themselves and their cronies from legal repercussions, grow right along with it.

    The US used nazis as a battering ram to tear down the government in Ukraine just as they are using far right wing extremist Wahabis to smash Syria and Iraq to pieces. Right wing extremism…

    Be careful. In all cases, you’re talking authoritarians. This is actually left wing in nature. The proper spectrum is between authoritarian on the left and libertarian on the right. Full scale Stalinist communism, and utter anarchy, are the two endpoints of that scale.

    All of this is a political problem at heart. The “black community” cannot solve it alone, because, just like for the “white community” at a certain level their leaders disappear into the elite machine.

    Straight up fact. And the problem is, those “leaders” who refuse to disappear into the elite machine…merely disappear.


    I am fighting for black rights!

    I’m right there with you. I’ve known too many good, decent people of all races – and awful, horrid people of all races – to get sucked into racism. I don’t think people have negro fatigue, I think they have “degenerate thug fatigue.”

  28. emsnews

    The slave owners wanted ‘free trade’ and the northern workers and manufacturers correctly….yes…CORRECTLY understood the value of protected industries!

    Thanks to Reagan and other Southerners we are now stuck with free trade, endless $7 trillion worth of trade deficits and facing future bankruptcy when the Chinese decide and they WILL decide this…to pull the plug on the dollar and cause it to collapse like the German mark after WWI.

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