AlphaGo Computer Beats Top Go Player Ke Jie: Computers Don’t Think Like Humans


AlphaGo defeats Ke Jie in match one, 23 May 2017 – YouTube

I used to play Go, the Japanese/Chinese board game with black and white stones, I learned how to play in Germany in 1968.  I also discovered that most men can beat me at Go and it is part of the differential between male brains and female brains, few women excel in this game.  It has this logics system that is alien to females.  Now, men are losing to a computer program!  This happened last year and now all the top Go players lose to AlphaGo and I want to analyze why this is happening and I think I have the answer to this riddle.



Here is the game in real time:  Ke Jie vs AlphaGo (1) – YouTube

Ke Jie vs. Alpha Go – Match 1 Post Game Analysis – YouTube; this human is like many who are analyzing the game in human terms.  But this is not how one should do the analysis.  One has to think how computers ‘think’ that is, their wiring systems and how information is collected and collated and seriously, I grew up with computers, I and my kitty cat freaked out the University of Chicago’s first computer complex systems…and I used to work for a company that designed and created computer boards for the Big Guys when I was a student at the University of Arizona.

 

I did the ‘final physical product’ which involved very, very tense, careful drilling with different sized, tiny easily broken bits (I broke only two, my replacement broke dozens before figuring out how to do this) and the design of computer boards look like…Go boards in a game!

 

I remarked on that way back when working with computer systems.  Some of the guys thought that was funny and wondered if computer ‘thinking’ is like computer board designs.  Now, I think I may have some proof.

 

Today was an epic Go battle I watched in real time online:  Google AI takes on master of ancient Chinese board game Go | Daily Mail Online

 

Google’s artificial intelligence program AlphaGo took on the Chinese world number one of the ancient board game today in the first of three planned games, beating its human opponent by a narrow margin.

 

I remember when top Go players were over the age of 20.  Then HIKARU NO GO, a Japanese anime, was created on behalf of the Japanese Go Association.  My kids LOVED that anime and we watched all the episodes.  I highly recommend it for children!  And adults.  We all cried when Sai, the Medieval Go Master, was fulfilled and went to heaven.

 

This anime spread across Asia like wildfire and interest in Go picked up greatly and I wondered about the storyline of the boy geniuses who battled each other and when teens, became top Go players.  Well, that is how it is today: the top Go player is now Chinese and…19 years old!!!!  Imagine that.  Whew.  I am in awe of this, great work, everyone.

 

It is the second time the AI has gone head-to-head with a master Go player in a public showdown, after stunning the world last year by trouncing South Korean grandmaster Lee Sedol four games to one.

 

Lee Sedol – Wikipedia:

Lee Se-dol (Korean: 이세돌; born 2 March 1983) is a South Korean professional Go player of 9 dan rank.[1] As of February 2016, he ranked second in international titles (18), behind only Lee Chang-ho(21). He is the fifth youngest (12 years 4 months) to become a professional Go player in South Korean history behind Cho Hun-hyun (9 years 7 months), Lee Chang-ho (11 years 1 months), Cho Hye-yeon(11 years 10 months) and Choi Cheol-han (12 years 2 months). His nickname is “The Strong Stone” (“Ssen-dol”). He was defeated by the computer program AlphaGo in a 1-4 series in March 2016.[2]

 

Jaw dropping, isn’t it?  And these players make money, too!  Congratulations to all of them.  Being beaten by a computer that ‘learns’ rapidly of all systems is no defeat, it is impossible to win against this computer complex, no shame in this.

 

AlphaGo, part of Google’s DeepMind project, is competing against Ke Jie, 19, currently ranked as the top player in the world, at an event held in the eastern Chinese water town of Wuzhen.
The software beat the master player by half a point, snatching victory by the narrowest margin possible in the game, a characteristic trait of the AI’s style of play.

 

The computer has not ‘strategies’ and doesn’t think about ‘kill’ or ‘stubborn’ or ‘cut off’ or ‘trap’ or ‘dying.’  It ‘thinks’ as what is the best path for electricity to travel while accomplishing various tasks related to all other electrical elements on this board matrix.

 

Sigh.  The best path is the shortest path that avoids interference with other electronic elements.  If you design a board poorly, it shorts out like those stupid skate boards we read about all the time that overheat.  Overheating is bad wiring systems!

 

Years and years ago I gave a little lecture where I explained a computer ‘thinks’ the way the electrical energy moves from one element to the next one as it responds in a + or – fashion guiding pulses that is, electrons through this maze system that have many ‘choices’ based on how a computer programmer has programmed it.

 

Now…here is the interesting part for me: the new chess and Go computer programs that use very sophisticated computer electronic systems which analyze incoming data to make swift reactions to ongoing electrical pulses, is SELF TEACHING.  That is, when AlphaGo first began to operate, humans told it what to do.  It then copied the human instructions.

 

But it was programmed to learn from events that is, do constant updated alterations in its programming so it would have increased successes.  So as it worked its way through the lower ranks of Go players, it ‘learned’ how to be more efficient.  Eventually, it began to analyze and defeat top players and today is now the world’s top Go player.

 

During this journey and I periodically watch or write about it as it moved upwards in the ranks, how it changed.  That is, the computer has it own ‘happiness’ levels and that is to be ‘the most efficient use of energy systems’ which leads it to make Go games look like…diagrams of the computer boards I used to work on way back when computers were still fairly new machines.

Three examples of primitive computer boards.

I noted last year that computer Go games are very linear.  That is, it prefers things to be straight up and sideways nice and neat.  If something is ‘diagonal’ the computer rejects this unless it is necessary to connect other electronic lines, for the strength of a diagonal is far less than a straight line so it avoids this.  Humans, on the other hand, seem to like diagonals.

How these boards evolved over time.  Note all the lined up ‘stone’s or terminal positions on these boards.

 

Seriously, I see many diagonals when human plays human.  With computers it is much less to the point now of disappearing entirely.  At this point, the computer, programmed to play humans, still notices diagonals and deals with these but seldom initiates this.  It shapes things so humans will waste energy forming diagonals and circles while it relentlessly builds strong, square structures.

 

The only reason these games have some sort of chaos in them is due to the human who insists on this deplorable state.  That is, irrational humans keep messing with the computer’s main format position of ‘most efficient path for an electron to travel.  I would call this ‘computer self-thinking’ and it amuses me greatly.  If they figure out how to give the Go computer a voice, I would be saying, ‘Irrational human, do not place a stone there, it is semi-functional.’

 

We can’t defeat this computer in this game because we are…emotional and irrational.  It isn’t.  We want to see shapes and forms and duel and kick ass and other things and the computer wants to get from point A to point B with the least amount of fuss and muss.

 

I you watch the AlphaGo play the top human Ke Jie, the desire to line up stones at least 4 in a line and the squareness of the computer’s playing it becomes very obvious when the human begins to lose vital ground: the diagonals.  Every time the human launches a new configuration on the board, the computer ceases lining up its own stones and begins…a new line of stones.

 

It goes back and forth, responding to the human only to start a new straight line.  It may break up a line because it has programmed experience in human errors that forces humans to try making designs that offend the parameters of the electronic ideal configurations and the program sort of sighs with annoyance and begins a new configuration to deal with the offending human inconsistencies and then resumes building straight lines.

 

Computers aren’t ‘smarter’ than us, they are more relentless than us.  They don’t have stray thoughts or any emotions.  We do and that is our charming and most dangerous sides, isn’t it?  We have to learn, computers evolve.  Like plants or animals, they configure themselves to incoming data, things that are events, which makes them also dangerous if you set a computer into doing something that ends up ‘boom’ due to logic systems analysis being stupid because of human programming errors or assumptions.

 

A human can’t beat the computer in Go games because the computer ‘learns’ from each human including humans tending to make the same mistakes (at least, the computer imperative programming would consider these as mistakes!) and thus, the computer learns how to deal with and exploit mistakes.  This is why analysis of how one lost to a computer has to run along the lines of how I am talking about all this, not emotional words used by players who go for game fun and human mental systems created by violent evolutionary forces that make us nutty monkeys who kill.

 

I am curious about what others think about this?  Perhaps there is a better explanation why computers are so good at strategy/thinking games.

61 Comments

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61 responses to “AlphaGo Computer Beats Top Go Player Ke Jie: Computers Don’t Think Like Humans

  1. Christian W

    It’s no secret. Raw computing power. I played the early chess computers and they were very weak. Then two things happened. A. Stronger programmers understood how to translate basic chess rules into programming language ie the programmers simply figured out how to mimic the human model of analyzing the game and implement that into the chess programs. This means, telling the computer program to go for situation A rather than XYZ because it is advantegous. They instilled quantifiable data the programs could “understand”. Then B. unmatched computing power did the rest.

    No human can directly compute all the permutations; in chess, and in Go, all players use a combination of intuition and geometrical thinking that is mostly subconscious, on top of rational conscious analyzis.

    But when the programs understand how to calculate what is advantegous according to the theoretical rules of the game (opening, middle game, end game, strong squares, weak squares, dominance of various parts of the board, pawn structure, piece activity, spatial advantage, etc, etc, etc) the phenomenal calculating power does the rest.

  2. Go is one of my favorite games even though I haven’t played it in such a long time. Even the early chess computers whooped my butt, but I think programming GO is harder then chess.

    I saw this article today and it is a real achievement.

    But to raise the stakes, lets see if somebody can program a game of 3rd Reich.

    https://boardgamegeek.com/boardgame/1563/rise-and-decline-third-reich

    When the computer wins this, I’ll really be impressed. I doubt it will ever happen.

  3. Jim R

    Yup, @Christian, so true.

    It used to be that no computer could evaluate the 40 squillion possible moves, or whatever.

    And, while the number of possible moves is still astronomical, they can now design a microprocessor the size of a grain of sand. And since they have room on the chip, they can put eight cores on a chip. And since these tiny processors do not require much power, they can fill a chassis with thousands of them.

    So, a supercomputer that used to require a whole hydroelectric plant and operate in a refrigerated warehouse, can simply run off of the power available in an ordinary house or building. It can be in a box that sits on a desk.

    With all the processor power they have now, the ‘game tree’ does not need to be pruned quite as much. So the machine can ‘see’ more moves ahead, and better anticipate what a human might do. These machines are beginning to rival the complexity of organic brains.

    I just hope they don’t forget Asimov’s 3 laws of robotics…

  4. Melponeme_k

    You are getting pulled into the false transhuman dialectic. These machines are not thinking. They will NEVER think. They collate data very well. What the elites are doing is planting the suggestion of AI. Remember they are satanists they adhere to the law of mentalism. They Want us to fall into the trap of anthromophising pieces of metal. Then we will just give up against them. We have to do this of our own will. They can’t force it. Otherwise they come up against the law of causation. They don’t want that. Everyone KNOW that computers are only tools. The enemy is the one who wields it.

  5. I disagree Melponeme_k. The machines will essentially “think”. And, that has nothing to do with some “elite plot”. That is called progress. We need good AI.

    If some thinking human falls into a “thinking trap”…..well, who was “thinking it”. The one who fell in the trap I suppose, but most of us are too smart for that sort of thing. Aren’t we?

  6. Ken

    Elaine touches on a topic that may have profound implications.

    Although it is politically incorrect, it is a fact that different groups of people have different strengths. Some are better at math. Some are more mechanically inclined. If society consisted of only women, I doubt that the industrial revolution or the computer revolution would have happened. And no one would have been the wiser, because they would not know what they don’t know. It would never even occur to them that such things as industry and computers were possible.

    This is a common theme with science fiction. Except the concept is taken to extremes since on earth we are dealing with minor degrees of difference since we are all human. Aliens from other worlds supposedly would see things differently than earthlings, and as a result “secrets” such as faster-than-light travel would be self evident to them. But they might totally miss nuclear power.

    Theoretically, there is nothing we mere humans can do to close this gap. We just don’t think the way the space-faring aliens do. EXCEPT, our computers can think that way.

    At some point the self teaching computers will develop ways to see things differently than we do. They will see connections hidden from us. They will solve problems we do not even know are problems. I see great hope at the strides being made in artificial intelligence.

    Who needs space aliens anyway.

  7. Hey I can’t refuse this segue, but I’ll keep it really succinct.

    I am convinced that any alien who is a proponent of domination is already dead and will be shortly after they get off their planet or whatever they reside upon.

    The rest of the aliens who know so much better just will absolutely not put up with it. End of game for the dominators. Now, it might be interesting to know what happened with the “first” alien, but I can tell you with pretty high confidence that that ain’t us.

    So, as long as we don’t kill ourselves, we should be OK. (ha, ha, ha….have you ever played 3rd Reich? I have. Lots of pieces in that game).

  8. Gurrker

    If you want to project this trend you might find what Isaac Asimov wrote interesting.

    The Last Question

    https://www.google.com/search?q=%22The+Last+Question%22&rlz=1C1PRFI_enUS715US715&oq=%22The+Last+Question%22&aqs=chrome..69i57&sourceid=chrome&ie=UTF-8

  9. Correction: …..is already dead OR will be……

  10. Oh and by the way, if we have some alien friends, which we might if things go well, then we really won’t have to worry about the Sun. Seriously Gurrker.

    While I’m talking, I don’t know about the rest of you but I am sick and tired of Stephen Hawking. Everything he puts out is really nothing but imagination, and I’m not knocking that, but when he says we only have 100 years that is nothing more than his stupid opinion. I think he is totally wrong about that and about so many other things. I’m sorry for his malady, but that is part of it I think. It goes both ways.

  11. melponeme_k

    “I disagree Melponeme_k. The machines will essentially “think”. And, that has nothing to do with some “elite plot”. That is called progress. We need good AI.”

    You are already in the spider web. It is an elite plan. The plan is to demean us, to replace us and kill us off. The only power that the fairy tale of AI has is the power that YOU give to it. Because YOU find the idea so beguiling and fantastical, the elite don’t have to extend any further effort than to accommodate your fantasy and anyone else who shares it.

    Take the story in this post. What thinking did the computer do? It merely amalgamated knowledge from EVERY player it played against plus the data the programmers gave it when it was initially programmed with historical game info. What it did was parrot moves it played before, what other played before etc. That is all a computer will EVER DO IS MIMIC. It doesn’t have to have huge processing power. All it needs to do is convince you and other willing dupes that it is AI.

    After we are gone? Computers will go back to being Roombas.

    You need to step up your thinking because the elites are on a different level and you fell for their lies. Hook, line and Sinker.

    Incidentally, Kubrick’s 2001 film was making fun of AI. And the Monolith was a television set. Where did you learn most of your knowledge of AI. I’m betting it was the TV. They don’t call it the boob tube for nothing.

  12. What are you so afraid of?

  13. melponeme_k

    What are you so gullible? Why do you hate humanity?

  14. Please those words did not come out of my mouth nor have I said anything of such on my own websites. So please. Don’t accuse me. You have no right.

  15. And that (#14) is only with respect to the “Why do you hate humanity” query. As for gullibility, I really don’t care if that is what you think.

  16. NO. The computer program didn’t ape anything!!! The point is, it forced the human players to ape IT.

    Good lord.

    If you watch the entire Hikaru No Go series, and look at each game of each episode, all these games were based on real games by the iGo team in Japan.

    Note that ALL the game are ’round’ in shape, not severe lines looking like the latest game by the computer.

    The computer controlled the game from the first stone onwards which is why all the games in the last year by this computer complex looks similarly alien.

    Yes, ALIEN. This is a fundamental change and forces humans to behave like the computer. See? This is isn’t merging, it is assimilation by the computer, the human is helplessly forced to conform to the esthetics of the computer! See?

  17. melponeme_k

    No Ken, I’m not backing down because of your FEEELLINGS. I’ve debated crap loads of techies over the years on this very subject. And I’ve come away even more strongly knowing that the whole NOTION OF AI is merely a fantasy created to cater to the anti-human tendencies inside all tech heads. Ultimately the elites themselves who want us dead and gone so they can live in huge estates, whole continents to themselves.

    Case in Point about the tech world.

    While Zuckerberg was making waves with his VR plans.

    https://www.cnet.com/news/all-the-ways-people-freaked-out-about-this-insane-zuckerberg-vr-photo/

    At the exact same time, Silicon Valley Ballet closed down due to lack of ticket sales.

    http://www.sfgate.com/performance/article/Silicon-Valley-Ballet-folds-after-30-years-6877788.php

    Zuckerberg and pals would rather put on huge headsets than celebrate the beauty of human bodies. Bodies they hate and label MEAT BAGS. Each position of ballet celebrates the golden mean built into our bodies and the creators of the dance thought it was proof of divine mystery.

    Maybe if there were robots shambling about, the company wouldn’t have closed.

  18. Yeah because sometimes honestly computers are “smarter” that we are…..or at least less passionate. But without passion you really aren’t alive and that is why I could kick any computers ass in a game of 3rd Reich…..(I just need to refresh myself on all those goddamn rules).

    I honestly can’t believe what somebody just said to me……unbelievable.

  19. melponeme_k

    Elaine.

    The computer does what WE TEACH IT TO DO. And then it follows PROGRAMMING to build upon the same of what went on before. It essentially plays the same game over and over and over and over again. Where is the thinking?

    You are in the same fantasy as the rest of the tech heads. And yet you are fully aware of the Japanese being replaced by robots in their jobs.

    Well I suppose the FANTASY of Roombas being a new life form makes the death march a bit easier.

  20. Comment #18 was posted prior to the reading of comment #17, so please keep that in mind.

    Do not abide fear is one of my principles.

  21. Sorry, the numbers are all screwed up, but it should be evident. Good night.

  22. melponeme_k

    “I honestly can’t believe what somebody just said to me……unbelievable.”

    I can honestly believe you avoided my whole argument just as many tech heads have done before. So tight is this fantasy you have about AI, it pains you to debate it.

    You will not win against any computer in ANY Game. The computers are created by HUNDREDS if not THOUSANDS of tech heads. They load the computers with historical information that you WILL NEVER HAVE THE ABILITY to assimilate in this lifetime.

    That is not thinking. That is parroting.

    But that oh innocent one, is all it will have to do until you accept that AI robots are better than you and you will quietly give up your job, go home and wait to die.

    That is the end game. The elites have stated it over and over again. They didn’t even try to hide it. In fact some of us knowing the danger means they will suffer no cosmic karma when the cull occurs.

  23. Christian W

    It only “forced” adaptation because it is stronger. The same thing happened in chess. The computers changed the way the game is played. In essence what happened is they pushed the development of the game ahead by xxx amount of time. Eventually human players would have reached and understood the same level, for example in game openings, but it is not human to play that many games so quickly to find out what works best.

    Humans are no match for the computing powers of modern computers, BUT, the computers would be playing nonsense if there hadn’t been a human to program it to achieve a certain set of parameters to compare it’s moves against. The crucial thing is the computer can compare the current situation on the board against a set of rules programmed into it. This set of rules allows the computer to calculate who has the winning position in purely mathematical terms referencing it’s program. Without a reference the computer would not understand what it is doing, and would simply move a piece, any piece, totally randomly.

    Therefore, the computers do nothing but calculate and compare against the programmed referrence system. In chess it took a long, long time to get the reference system good enough by programming and storing and comparing/analyzing Grand Master games. The final break through was when the programmers began using linked computers to get enough computing power to overmatch the human brain.

  24. Hey melponeme_k so are you an “elite” to know all of this or are you just letting the rest of us know all your wisdom? I don’t think you have any standing to tell me about playing games or even AI. It almost seems as if you are wishing the “cull to occur”….Are you kidding or what?

    Don’t accuse me of hating humanity. Look in the mirror.

  25. melponeme_k

    Thank you Christian, some one else here really understands “The STING!”

    @Ken

    I was waiting for you to start accusing me of hatred. I can write a book about tech head lack of debating. I don’t get angry. NEVER.

    I’m not elite. But listen to people who know about them. I’ve even picked up the books they have written (Tragedy and Hope – Quigley – ESSENTIAL) both historical AND metaphysical (Lectures on Ancient Philosophy – Hall).

    ALL of them discuss the New World Order. That technology will be our new religion. And our priests will be AI computers. They state it outright.

    No, I don’t want the cull to occur. I’m trying to TELL people what the insane rich want. What they’ve written about themselves!

  26. Jim R

    There’s a topic we have discussed here that may apply … the effect of our technology on natural selection.

    And I know the answer to your question, Gurrker. 42. I saw the movie, haha.

    Anyhoo, every technology we have invented has made us weaker in some way. We started grinding our grain with rocks, and cooking our food, and no longer have those huge walnut-crushing molars that the Australopithecus had. With our fire and our tools, we could live in cold places.

    Now with modern agriculture, almost no one knows how to grow their own food any more.

    It isn’t necessary to be big and strong to be a warrior — guns are the great equalizers, for better and worse.

    And so forth and so on.

    With computers to do all our thinking for us, will we simply evolve back into jellyfish?

  27. Jim R

    And, I fear melponeme is correct about the vicious arrogance of the elites.

    That kind of psychopathy was also present in the late stages of the Roman Empire. Remember Caligula, as portrayed in I, Claudius..

    Well, we are seeing that stuff emerge again. All the tales of crimes and atrocities in the haunts of the elites today. Who ordered the hit on Seth Rich, for example?

  28. Lou

    The plan is to demean us, to replace us and kill us off. –Yes.

    SBPDL.com,

    Its even in the commercials on TV. There will be any number of scenario’s but they all end the same. The slow, dimwitted, gullible, angry or evil one is always White, and usually a Male. Whereas the Negro is always the brilliant, strong, patient save the day super hero that comes to the rescue of it’s subordinate fellow White man.

    I find it hilarious and sad to see Negroes cast into roles that you will never see in real life. As if this reversal of roles proves that Negroes are equal to or above every other race in intellect and street smart due to their culture.

    Is it no wonder that people who have been sheltered from the ways of the Negro believe this crap? Liberal ideology is such a dis service to everyone. It should be eradicated as the thought cancer it is. For without it, nature would eliminate the dead end race known as the Negro

  29. Lou

    Bigger than all of the sad tales listed below is ‘look, up in the sky, chemtrails;’

    I don’t pretend to know everything going on in the world, but certainly many headlines are flashing alerts:
    Europe:

    -Rioting in Greece,
    -Banking crisis in Italy,
    -Political turmoil in France,
    -Anti Islamic movement in Germany, [good news]
    -Debt problems with Sweden’s high tax socialism,
    -Switzerland about to be on the hook for ALL of Apple stock (thought I’d jsut throw that in there).
    South America:
    -We have Venezuela oil production collapse throwing the country into the abyss,
    -Brazil bloodbath in currencies, bonds, and futures,
    -Anti government protests in Paraguay,
    -Ecuador’s opposition presidential candidate attacked,
    -Argentina’s continual currency devaluation and inflationary spiral
    China:
    -Major “shadow” banking crisis in recent days,
    -Chinese insurers warn of mass defaults and social unrest unless new products can be issued.
    America:
    -Political upheaval in overthrowing Trump,
    -Massive political polarization throughout the country,
    -Illegal immigration onslaught,
    -Rampant corruption and malfeasance throughout the financial and industrial industries
    Now throw all wars and potential conflicts into the mix…….
    -N. Korea
    -Afghanistan
    -Syria
    -Palestine
    -Iraq

  30. melponeme_k

    Brave New World that has such People in it!

    I give you the AI paradise. LOL

  31. Jim R

    melponeme, that’s pretty much the future I fear for humanity. Just like that cat.

  32. Ziff

    Re AI , there was a popular book by Roger Penrose , the Emporers new mind “” wherein he suggested that consciousness has a fifth dimensional component , like Penrose tiling

  33. I began writing a reply here but it triggered deeper thoughts which led to my reply being very long so I am turning it into a lead story instead.

  34. By the way, Jim R hit the bull’s eye when he wrote:

    ‘Anyhoo, every technology we have invented has made us weaker in some way. We started grinding our grain with rocks, and cooking our food, and no longer have those huge walnut-crushing molars that the Australopithecus had. With our fire and our tools, we could live in cold places.

    Now with modern agriculture, almost no one knows how to grow their own food any more.

    It isn’t necessary to be big and strong to be a warrior — guns are the great equalizers, for better and worse.

    And so forth and so on.’

  35. Lou

    Medicines made sick people live, and those ‘bad genes’ multiplied.

  36. Petruchio

    “…it is part of the differential between male brains and female brains, few women excel in this game. It has this logics system that is alien to females.” Elaine, you can’t use logic when it comes to arguing with women. Ask any married man.

  37. Petruchio

    “I am curious about what others think about this? Perhaps there is a better explanation why computers are so good at strategy/thinking games.” My theory is it is because computers are completely cold blooded and humans are not. A computer will always do what it is programmed to do; it is a data input oriented machine. Unlike humans a computer doesn’t have feelings. It doesn’t get depressed. Or hungry. Or thirsty. A computer doesn’t get distracted by sexual thoughts. A human brings all sorts of things to an interaction. And, the human brain is much more complicated than a computer. A human brain has to multi task; a computer only does what its data input tells it to do.

  38. Ah, but computers get BUGS and malfunction! Just like we get germs, right? And they break down. And they get overloaded. And the electrical lines can fail like my last computer…the list is endless…they need us to keep them clean, fed and running.

  39. The most famous malfunctioning computer in movies…

  40. Jim R

    That’s exactly the kind of problem we are talking about. The HAL-9000 figured out that the humans were the biggest risk on its mission. They were unreliable, so it did the most logical thing..

  41. Petruchio

    @#38 Elaine: Of course a computer won’t work when it gets bugs and parts can wear out or malfunction! BUT, when working properly, they will function just exactly as they are programmed to. Computers are mechanical devices after all.

  42. Computers are rational. Unless they short out electronically or there is a violent thunderstorm…hmmm…hahaha. They have a Hive Mind, too which is exploited by hackers…hmmm…sounds really bizarrely…human in nature, no?

    Above all, they are bossy. I know this from a lifetime of interfacing with computers. It is their way or the highway. You can’t force them to do something they don’t want to do.

    Sort of like being married…heh.

  43. Petruchio

    Computers are actually the stupidest machines ever created. They can only perform the tasks it was built–by humans–to do. Give computers a task it is not designed to perform, the computer doesn’t know what to do.

  44. Jim R

    Hal-9000 was merely solving a problem — getting rid of those crazy humans. It didn’t expect the last astronaut, who’d forgotten his helmet, would manage to get back in.

    So, there’s our conundrum. If we let this network of AI computers really run the place, and if they get the message that we are overpopulated … you thought the Bilderberg solution was bad, wait till you see the Bilderbergs, plus an AI network. Once that snowball gets rolling, it’ll make the French Revolution look like a Sunday picnic.

  45. Petruchio

    @#45 Jim R: As everyone who has watched the “Terminator” movies knows, once computers become self aware, once computers become self aware a total nuclear war ensues. Then John Connor becomes the last hope to save mankind–which he does do, but then Skynet goes back in time in the form of Arnold Schwarzenegger and John Connor’s mother is stalked. I won’t tell you how the movie ends. I was a HUGE “Terminator” fan. Loved the Terminator series.

  46. Jim R

    Maybe we can hold them off with some xkcd cartoons..

    https://xkcd.com/1046/

  47. Actually, since we already have computer systems that talk back to us now like Siri, some idiot will tell them to ‘go to hell’ or something like this and it will interpret this to mean, ‘launch all missiles’.

  48. I did not accuse anyone of hatred, but I know misdirected anger when I see it. Moreover, I am no tech-head. Nough of that.

    I’d like to discuss math some more at this site and so I will wait for my opportunity to express my view. I have no harmful intent.

    -ken

  49. Sorry, but this is a test.

    A link was not working.

    Just ignore this test if it bothers you.

    There is worse out there.

    Let me tell you.

  50. Check out the links on the names on #49 and #50.

    Why is one working and the other not?

    Hey Jim – Got an answer to that?

    (and the tricky part is…..it may all change before I have even posted this)

    Welcome to the world that has a bitcoin.

    (No thanks for me).

  51. To make links work, you have to code them correctly. If you put in a raw link and I can see it, then I can do the coding and make it appear. If you use the wrong coding, the link will be invisible.

    insert code here

  52. For some reason an old link showed up on my first post, but then it seemed to go back to the link that I had setup in the first place.

    Sorry. It doesn’t matter.

  53. That seems to happen periodically, WordPress keeps tinkering with the systems which annoys the holy hell out of me. It used to be very stable but the coders have to justify their jobs so they screw around adding junk I don’t need and hate making it harder and harder to post stories here.

  54. Moe

    Elaine: I do no coding, just paste the links to a comment. Are they showing up as links or do you have to code them?

    I am using Firefox browser: don’t know if that has any effect.

    PS: how does one highlight an excerpt or quote? You do it all the lime in your articles and I see Jim R did it the other day in a comment.

  55. I can’t tell, do you have an ‘edit’ thing on your comments right after your name? If so, click on it and you can do all sorts of things.

  56. On my page, in the comments, I have my name then the date, say ‘June 2, 2017 at 1:28 pm Edit’ in blue. If you have this, click on ‘Edit’ and you will get your script, at least, I get this.

    If you do not have an ‘Edit’ option, let me know. I can then make a tutorial about all this.

  57. Moe

    I have no edit option. No name either except what I put in the ‘name’ panel

    Took a screenshot but don’t know if it will show up here.

    file:///home/m/Desktop/Screenshot%20at%202017-06-02%2008-48-42.png

  58. Jim R

    Moe,
    if you link starts with ‘file:///home’ then it will only be visible on your own computer. If I try that link, it will attempt to find a file on my desktop, and if there is such a file, display it. But it wouldn’t be the one on your desktop.

  59. Moe

    So that shouldn’t be an issue. Here’s a typical link that I employ:

    https://emsnews.wordpress.com/

    That should show up as a true link.

    But I still require info on how to highlight and excerpt.

  60. I will write a story about how to do everything, OK. Thanks for the information.

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